New info: Head over to our friends at 4wide.com for a copy of what is said to be a negative lab report on Mayfield. Offered by his attorney, it looks like the other side of this issue is slowly creeping toward the surface. It's now or never. Click here for the direct link.
The hero, the underdog and the persecuted. Jeremy Mayfield worked the legal and public relations angles continually since his initial positive urine test for meth.
Right up to the end, he maintained his innocence and pointed to his victory in a recent court ruling that returned him, in theory, to the track.
The end came Wednesday afternoon when NASCAR confirmed through documents submitted to the court that Mayfield has indeed tested positive once again for meth. Now, the logical conclusions begin to fall on the other side.
Mayfield's attorney suggested the first test from Aegis had reported meth levels so high a normal person would have been a zombie. The only exception would have been someone who was a longtime addict. That seems to be someone named Jeremy Mayfield.
The long and confusing story about Mayfield getting lost on the way to a Monday test now makes sense. Mayfield was attempting to dilute his sample and delay the test. This time, it did not work.
NASCAR has basically asked the District Court to end the temporary injunction it granted Mayfield. The judge told NASCAR it could test Mayfield whenever it pleased. They did and confirmed the first result. This time, NASCAR and Aegis took the time to close all the loopholes.
In a way, all of this comes to a close at the only quiet time before the seventeen race run to the 2009 Sprint Cup Series Championship. ESPN2's NASCAR Now, SPEED's Wind Tunnel and The SPEED Report will be the only shows on the air. There is no RaceDay, no SPEED Stage and no This Week in NASCAR.
By the time things crank-up for The Brickyard, Mayfield will have joined the number of other NASCAR license-holders this season who have been asked to leave and get their lives in order because of substance abuse.
This time, let's hope for the sake of the sport that Brian France and Dr. Black do not appear on camera for interviews. In addition, it should be interesting to see which local media types try to get Mayfield on-camera to see what direction his life is taking.
NASCAR's Sprint Cup Series drivers and teams are enjoying about ten days of vacation before the long run to late November. Upon their return, they may all be relieved to know that one troublesome topic is off the table and NASCAR can concentrate on racing once again.
Click here to be reminded of why we used "drowning face down" on the title of this post. The band is Saving Abel.
Story links, click on the title to read the story:
Mayfield again tests postive for meth. (Jenna Fryer from the AP)
NASCAR says Mayfield tests positive. (AJ Perez from USA Today)
Update: Mayfield made a poor decision to go on the Sirius NASCAR channel Wednesday. Among other memorable quotes: "Brian France talking about effective drug policy is like Al Capone talking about effective law enforcement."
Click here for WSOC-TV's Alan Cavanna who got Mayfield on-camera talking about the issues.
Friday update: WBTV learned from a source on Thursday that Mayfield has sold his race shop and equipment located on Highway 49 in Harrisburg, NC.
TDP has followed this story from the start. Readers have been very vocal in their opinions of the NASCAR media and how this story was covered. We would ask for your final opinion on this topic in terms of how you got information about Mayfield and what you think was good and bad in the coverage of this episode?
To add your opinion, just click on the comments button below. This is a family-friendly website, please keep that in mind when posting. Thanks for stopping by, even on this sad day. Good luck to Mayfield in his recovery, it has to start somewhere. Today might be a good choice.
Just wow.
ReplyDeleteW-O-W!
Really disappointed in Jeremy, kudos to NASCAR for standing up and holding their ground despite getting beat up in the media and by some fans. They clearly felt something was wrong here and this really backs that up.
Hopefully this is discussed on SPEED when we get to Indy as everyone has an extra week to get all their facts together, maybe ESPN will discuss it Saturday.
The science never lied. While the policy needs some adjustments, the tests and their accuracy were never in doubt.
ReplyDeleteI hope Mayfield admits his problem and gets treatment.
Mayfield's behavior now makes sense-when you are addicted, your behavior becomes irrational. His behavior was irrational. I'm sure he didn't get lost on the the way to the lab.
ReplyDeleteI am still skeptical. NASCAR has handled this poorly from day one. Just don't trust them. Not sure I completely trust Jeremy but they haven't convinced me of anything.
ReplyDeleteDisgusted.
ReplyDeleteI am not surprised, much of Mayfield's yapping was about the procedure and the method, not the results. That was a clue for me from the start. And the 7/6 escapade? You knew something was up.
Now I'm disgusted and really angry at him and his slimy attorney for dragging the sport's name through the mud, when at least one of them knew all along he was a LIAR.
I guess he did not expect to prevail in court last week, and when he did and had to consent to the test, I can imagine the first 2 words from his mouth.
As far as winning the injunction so fast, for him it was a situation of be careful what you ask for, you just may get it.
Good riddance to him.
hey gang. picked this up here at TDP first and just finished newton's article on espn.com (yeah, broke my self-imposed boycott but this seemed worth it.) so far, i haven't seen it on "all the usual suspects" sites yet.
ReplyDeletei need to prowl about the 'net for a while and check in with some other sites which i have come to trust. but gut instinct? i'm with ryan: "the science never lied."
and many, many thanks to dr diandra leslie-pelecky for tackling the science of it all early on. her blog went a long way to explaining the science of it for me and i returned to it repeatedly when much of the "stuff" came up.
sad day for mayfield, to be certain.
The comments from his stepmother are the most damning thing, I think.
ReplyDeleteHe's been doing meth since the 90s?!
You just can't put your trust in anyone, anymore.
Brenda,
ReplyDeleteApparently that was a big tipoff. He absolutely was avoiding and telling lies about it. That is really when the tide turned.
Anon 7:34PM,
It may well be that Mayfield's attorney is just as surprised as many readers. Mayfield himself did a great selling job on everyone from Marty Smith to the District Court.
JD
Anon 7:39PM,
ReplyDeleteWhat does that tell you about NASCAR's drug issues before this season?
JD
Good point, JD.
ReplyDeleteClearly, there was a need for this testing policy all along.
http://twitter.com/SIRIUSXM128
ReplyDeleteSays Mayfield is on the radio....
JD, it means that Nascar wasn't immune like it thought it was. However, anyone who could think critically had to know that it was a problem in Nascar, just like its a problem everywhere else.
ReplyDeleteMy hope is that they refine the testing procedures to avoid messes like this in the future, and that it scares the crap out of drivers (and others at the track).
Hopefully this sad issue will be done with by the end of Indy weekend.
Mayfield is DONE...
ReplyDeleteUnlike Shane Hmiel and a few others who got a second chance, he will NEVER get a second chance....
And he never should.
I'm totally unsurprised. His behaviour last Monday bore all the hallmarks of an addict trying desperately to find some way to avoid a positive test. That's the point I was trying (obliquely) to make when I wrote about masking and urine substitution last week. Any bets he went to the local head shop in his travels?
ReplyDeleteI guess we'll find out for sure when his B sample is tested at an independent lab of his choosing.
--KarenB
Wow. from what I heard of Buddy Baker and company, Jeremy aggressively defended himself.
ReplyDeleteStill calling it all lies, saying he is innocent. When his results from his testing facilities come in he will be cleared, NASCAR is out to get him, figures he is done in NASCAR.
Even has his own documentary crew following this story...
This comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeletetweeted pockrass for clarification as his article says buric (mayfield's att'y) claims that a sample taken within one hour of the nascar sample on 7/6 and tested by labcorp tested negative. so, that makes three samples that day? one when buric sent mayfield to a lab of their choosing when mayfield got lost on the way to the nascar lab; one taken by nascar at mayfield's home; and now one taken an hour after the nascar sample? am i misreading this b/c that's a piece of information that hasn't come out until now, i think.
ReplyDeletealso in that article:
"Buric said Mayfield’s sample given to LabCorp is going to be analyzed further to match the procedures used by Aegis."
so, buric states their test from labcorp was negative but then goes on to say that they need to do more testing to match the protocol aegis used? so . . . it isn't really a definitive negative.
i'm sticking with science here, gang.
The only thing that surprised me from the media side of this story was Speed and Fox "burying their heads in the sand" on the day the story initially broke at Darlington.
ReplyDeleteSpeed's decision to hype the 6:00 press conference for the entire Raceday show and then not show it live at the expense of showing Hermie goofing around in the infield with the "Vote Me Into the All-Star Race" campaign drivers instead was extemely disappointing to me.
Fox's decision to cover this MAJOR story during their pre-race show by having Chris Myers mix in a one sentence NASCAR statement about the suspension with other 'Fox Watch' news and notes while DW and Jeff Hammond sat there in silence and then immediately transition to the subject of the "mystique of the Lady in Black" with no further comment on the subject was flat out embarrassing, in my personal opinion.
I'm just thankful that Gateway and the Brickyard are not on Fox, because I'm sure ESPN will give this story it's proper due and take the time to ask their experts to give their in-depth opinions on this latest news.
As I voiced on this blog in the first post on this subject months ago, I think things in the media would have gone much more smoothly if the 'confidentiality clause' was waived once Mayfield publicly cried out in innocence. Not waiving this clause made everyone immediately point fingers with no legitimate information to go off of and made the media waste countless time speculating, asking questions of NASCAR's people and drug experts about a drug whose identity was unknown, and brought the inevitable and very dangerous leaking of information by anonymous sources.
IF this latest story proves to be accurate and IF Mayfield is indeed guilty, the most troubling part of all this is that some judge intervened and decided to overrule NASCAR's suspension and allow Mayfield to drive at Daytona and Chicago. IF this proves to be accurate then I am extremely thankful that Mayfield couldn't find a ride for those races and that judge didn't single-handedly put the lives of 42 other drivers in danger by allowing Mayfield to race.
IF this is accurate then I certainly wish the best to Jeremy and his family and I hope he can find the necessary help to get his life and career back on track.
This Mayfield thing is one of the best efforts from the ESPN reporting crew in recent years.
ReplyDeleteNewton, McGee and Smith have been very good and even when they were criticized they carried on.
Mayfield's phone call to Smith recently is a great set-up for the news today.
Let me just say this between us girls, NASCAR is saying this is air-tight for meth.
JD
Glad it is over. What a farce. And how sad for Jeremy. He had the opportunity to fix this problem with the help of NASCAR and family and friends. But what did he do? Took a lot of people on a unnecessary ride. And accused NASCAR of targeting him.
ReplyDeleteWhat I am totally mortified by is that he has been on the track since the 90's on meth! Now that is scary. Even more, that his step mother knew and didn't tell anyone. How about his wife? Was racing more important than seeing someone destroy their life and possibly endanger or kill someone else.
To those who said "can't be, he doesn't LOOK like a meth user" this is indeed a sad lesson.
And yes...believe the science!
Im with Buddy Baker who says this is far from over. Sadly, I must agree.
ReplyDeleteJeremy is going to drag this out as long and as far as he possibly can now. He realizes his career driving is over. He has nothing left to lose I don't think.
I'm disappointed, not surprised but disappointed. I am guessing this is going 1 of 2 ways. 1 He'll stick to his story and it's a combo problem and all the Nascar experts are wrong. 2 He'll fade away. If him being on the radio is true we are going #1. I also wonder what his relationship is with his step-mom. What mother would throw their son under the bus like that, is it a bad relationship or someone who is trying to do the tough love push them into rehab route. This entire thing is just sad.
ReplyDeletegotta love twitter:
ReplyDelete"bobpockrass: yes three samples in one day. not concerned about first sample because it wasn't done as close to the time of the NASCAR test."
Did any reporter ask Mayfield if he stopped taking the Adderall and Claritin-D that he says caused the false positive in the first place?
ReplyDeleteI guess he must have, if he claims he's innocent. I'm sure Aegis wouldn't be caught out by that problem twice...
--KarenB
You think Mark Martin still won't mind racing against Mayfield after this?
ReplyDeleteIf Mayfield has been using meth as long as NASCAR now claims, someone had to know about it. Why did it take so long to get him off the track?
ReplyDeleteOMG! To think I was on his side.
ReplyDeleteI haven't read the comments yet, just wanted to throw mine in now.
Rhetorical here. Why would he do meth? What was he thinking?
He's done now, even if he does clean up. I was so hoping it wasn't true. I'm disappointed in him and in myself. Here I thought big bad NASCAR had it in for him. Thanks Jeremy.
One good thing, no CUP race this weekend. I'm with you JD, I also hope that BF and Co just lets this go away.
I think before JM's lawyer spouts off too much he should tell us what BOTH test results were that Jeremy had done (or so he said) and better than positive or negative maybe they should be testing DNA. JM certainly had plenty of time and opportunity to get someone else's urine to provide for a sample. Might be why he was so mad that the lab tech watched so he couldn't switch then. Why else would he run out yet to another lab after claiming he had already done so? And the lawyer saying Aegis shouldn't have done the tests, why didn't he protest when the judge told them that NASCAR could test when ever they wanted, he knew who would be doing the tests.
ReplyDeleteTotal smoke and mirrors on JM's part from the very beginning.
hopefully now people will actually believe nascar, and not assume theyre always wrong about everything
ReplyDeleteAnon 8:36PM,
ReplyDeleteThe reason this topic is so big with many of us veteran fans is because this is the first season of NASCAR having a professional drug policy that includes testing in place.
Multiple crew members and now one active driver have already been asked to step away from the sport this season and address the substance issues NASCAR has found.
Mayfield is the first driver and person in the public spotlight. He has insisted and I believe from reports is still insisting that he is innocent.
He had many fans, was a redhot driver at one time and had one of the most popular NASCAR TV commercials in recent memory.
Heeeeeeeeey Jeremy! That was heard for years whenever he walked by NASCAR fans.
This issue might be done as far as Mayfield on the track, but I fear just from what I have read in the last fifteen minutes...it is far from over.
JD
hey dot. speaking from painful experience, no reason to be disappointed in yourself so don't go there. if mayfield is addicted, the responsibility lies solely with him, no one else. not his wife, family, friends and certainly not his fans.
ReplyDeletethe feeling of betrayal that mayfield's friends, colleagues, employees and fans are feeling is the toughest part of it for me.
be gentle with yourself over this one, dot.
(after all, i had ambrose wrecking out in chicago when it was actually hornish!!)
To directly answer the question Mr. Daly posed at the end of the article...
ReplyDeleteAs I am now unemployed and can no longer afford to pay for DVR service from my local cable company (as I live on the west coast and thus miss much of what I would like to see when it runs live), I got most of my information on this story via the Internet in news stories, opinion pieces, and video clips. I did watch NASCAR-related shows on Speed but I must agree that they did nothing but run away from the issue.
The story was covered poorly. Then again, what story isn't covered poorly these days in the era of cutbacks in news divisions, agenda-based reporting (both "right" and "left"), and hardly any daily program willing to go in depth on any news story beyond the nightly show on PBS? Had this happened in a time past, I have a feeling that a qualified news reporter would have been on the case and turned up witnesses to Jeremy's activities much faster and saved us all a lot of speculation. ESPN did a better job in what I got to see from them, but they only covered the surface -- they failed to dig deep in the way they would if this had involved an NFL player so vehemently denying his suspension.
On the speculation part, a lot of what went on there appears to me to lie at NASCAR's feet due to the poor structure of their drug testing program, the terrible way Brian France and his underlings handled the matter, and the general distrust many fans now have of NASCAR in the light of the many unwanted changes and gaffes we have seen ever since the television contracts were consolidated and especially in the wake of The Chase and the "Car of Templates."
On the other hand, Jeremy did one heck of a job in denying the accusation against him, didn't he? I hadn't really commented on this story as it developed here on The Daly Planet because I was really not sure who to believe. My heart was with my fellow Kentuckian, but my head kept asking what in the world he could have done to get NASCAR to conspire against him in this era where he was probably appreciated for helping to fill fields with a well-known driver in these difficult economic times.
I was leaning toward believing Jeremy because false positives can and do happen in drug testing. Now, we have no doubt. I was wrong and I want to apologize to NASCAR for starting to not believe them in this case.
Finally and no matter what side you took or what you thought of the coverage, let's not lose sight of the fact that this is yet another tragedy of people who have succumbed to a drug or alcohol addiction. After all, Jeremy was a race winner in Cup. How many more races could he have won had he not developed his behavior problems that are now obviously attributable to meth? Could he have been a champion? Could he have been a better teammate and helped his various owners be more successful? We'll never know because he was toasted on crank.
What a sad thing for those of us from Kentucky who always look for people to be proud of that come from our state that is made fun off so much. What a sad thing for his friends and business partners that believed in him. What a sad thing for his family that must now deal with the shame of what he has done. Most of all, what a sad thing for Jeremy who will probably live the rest of his life away from the sport that made him famous and now have to decide if he is going to remain on his current path or try to kick his dangerous and deadly habit.
Wow. how sad..and INDEED why didn't somebody who KNEW say something before now..though usually if highly addicted to that stuff, you age somethin' fierce..so that doesn't add up unless he used other stuff to keep the edge off from doing it daily.
ReplyDeleteHe must be related to Pete Rose who SWORE for 18 years he never bet on baseball. Denial is powerful but it makes me wonder about MANY other drivers at this point, sad to say.
Most folks never saw Jeremy as a partier.
As far as "humiliating" to take a drug test with a witness? Standard procedure for some places ESPECIALLY when suspicious. I hardly think it's all that humiliating. Try a full body cavity search when you are innocent, Jeremy. That happens at airports sometimes.
Man oh man.
Hope NASCAR will step up the testing on EVERYBODY and ESPECIALLY those driving.
Didn't want to believe it but obviously he has a huge tolerance for the stuff...I've know or read of many humans have huge tolerances to hard booze/prescription pills.
But in the end, doesn't matter if it's illegal drug or now. If it makes you under the influence you stay off the road/track.
He did have that vacant look in his eyes as he was denying which can mean "liar" and kind of had me suspicious, but then again, I listened to Pete Rose on many talk shows and heard from "low lifes" that went to prison squeal. Well, truth is truth no matter where it comes from.
I hope his (ex?)mother-in-law is proud of herself. What if he would've hurt somebody or worse??? Sorry, I would have to turn somebody in..same as I would if somebody were an airline pilot or a surgeon.
Soph it's his step-mom. Nascar Insiders has a link to Jenna Fryers AP piece. It makes it sound even worse, he use to make it himself before pseudophed went behind the counter. While I am not sure I totally believe her I do believe the science.
ReplyDeleteDot Red's right unfortunately I also have some of my own painful experience in these matters, you want to trust and believe the ones you care about.
Wow! I just read the Jenna Fryer piece that has numerous quotes from stepmother. According to her he was cooking the stuff himself until pseudoephedrine became unavailable off the shelf. Jeremy called her something I can't type here.
ReplyDeleteThis is so tragic. I've been fortunate not to ever be around someone addicted to drugs, so it is just so hard to believe the extent Jeremy is going to in denying all of this.
I do not understand why some are saying NASCAR needs to amend the policy (maybe the list thing, but how would that have helped this case?). Jeremy tested positive and is in denial. Why has no one else, crew memembers, contested it?
The only thing I thought Jeremy had, on a technicality, was the A and B samples being tested by the same the lab, Aegis. Is this standard practice? Unique to NASCAR? Maybe I missed an article comparing NASCAR to other sports policies. So, I am still confused at what NASCAR needs to change.
STEP-MOTHER it wasn't his mother in law, it was his stepmother.
ReplyDeleteI can't believe JM was that much of an addict and for that long and no one knew about it or had any idea? And stepmom says he cooked it for himself for a while? I don't know. I don't want to go into the black helicopter area but I have my doubts. But I agree this isn't over yet by a long shot.
ReplyDeleteKoHoSo said...
ReplyDelete...After all, Jeremy was a race winner in Cup. How many more races could he have won had he not developed his behavior problems that are now obviously attributable to meth? Could he have been a champion? Could he have been a better teammate and helped his various owners be more successful? We'll never know because he was toasted on crank.
-------------------------------
If you go by the stepmom's affidavit (using since 1998), he was winning races and getting 10-15 top tens a year during the period he was using ('98 was his best season overall and he had 5 wins from '98 to '05 and two Chase appearances)! What does that say about this whole thing?
People probably did know, but at the same time I honestly think there is a unwritten rule in the garage of "dont ask, dont tell"
ReplyDeleteIve heard lots of things about drivers that would probably blow some minds. Maybe everything ive heard are fabrications but the idea of Jeremy being a meth addict? Does not surprise me in the slightest.
Im not shocked someone got caught, little shocked he flunked the test twice though.
I am still not buying all of this. I don't believe this positive result, I've heard Mayfield say he had to be careful what he ate before a race so he wouldn't get sick that doesn't sound like someone who is taking drugs. Also, what Ray E and several others said about him that they never saw him incapacitated or show signs of anything. I'm still not convinced. And his step-mother saying something like he saw him take meth over 30 times isn't logical. I don't know a lot about illegal drugs but he wouldn't look like he does if he had been doing that according to some sources.
ReplyDeleteI have no sympathy for JM especially if he has been using as long as has been reported. He had every chance to clean his act up and he has no one to blame but himself and to think he put that many people in jeopardy, that just boggles my mind.
ReplyDeleteSorry, just came back to correct myself. STEPMOM.
ReplyDeleteBut who the hello smokes meth or does drugs in front of a parental figure??????????? Not sure what to make of her but then again, recent tests do not lie.
HUGE QUESTION: Since Jeremy tested negative in past tests, exacty HOW were those tests performed?
I worked in an office where somebody was addicted to prescription drugs *but unless you LIVED with them you would never EVER have guessed it, EVER*. The post rehab check ups would call a few times a month. All the lady would say to me is tell dr. so and so "Today's the day." He would go in his bathroom, pee in a cup, and the nurse would pack it off for shipping. NO she did not witness it but once thought the cup felt a little cool for urine but thought it was her imagination.
Turned out it was not. It was 'stored urine' under a sink in the doctor's office..he had slipped a couple of times and the med had a long half life. So that tested negative but later, the doc checked himself into rehab ANOTHER FOUR MONTHS!! (that's the minimum time for doctor's at this center)
Course, turns out the doc took speed for UNDIAGNOSED heart trouble and needed a heart transplant..thus his crushing fatigue. Of course, still no excuse to do drugs..but it was a very sad thing to witness.
Not to mention the stories we had to tell pregnant patients of where he had to go for FOUR MONTHS (Special 'research')
SO I am well familiar with addiction and how THE WHOLE WORLD CAN LOVE A PERSON and have no clue. It's not like they go around slurring words or getting into a stupor. And this doctor never did surgery under the influence.
But had we KNOWN, we would've said something I can assure you.
Sometimes I would go to get a drug at the pharmacy and they would ask if I lived at such and such address. NO, turns out when the doctor was using, he would use my name (among others!)..then again, being a doctor he could write his own script but I digress.
Anyway, I feel badly for Jeremy's friends and loved ones..but his wife had to know. The wives ALWAYS KNOW..at least in hindsight.
I hate seeing this is true...I really wanted to believe in Jeremy..but I wanted to believe that doctor, too.
He got the heart transplant and died 3 years ago..but he was still a BELOVED DOCTOR by ALL his patients, family and friends.
I know because he was a part of MY family since I was seven years old.
So just because Jeremy is an addict, does not make him scum.
Though I realize the mud slinging has only begun.
:(
Sorry for the manifesto but this strikes close to home and brings back memories.:(
Though I just remember the great things patients said about him saving their life, or a baby's life. And he was a famous local musician of Big Band music. NOBODY in the 20 piece band ever had a clue there was a problem either...so...Jeremy must've kept it well controlled.
Soph the wife doesn't always know. Some take longer to figure it out and some let denial stay around longer than they should and some never know.
ReplyDelete@ red, thank you for your kind words.
ReplyDeleteI do worry about my credibility here at TDP. You guys have become by friends and I wouldn't want to be thought less of. When I comment, I don't want anyone to think, "Oh, there's lame Dot, typing out of her rear."
I just read Jenna Fryer's story. Why would Jeremy's step mom lie? I wish she would have said something before now. Ten years? Good grief. Good thing Jeremy didn't maim or kill someone, on or off the track.
I'm just glad we won't have to deal with this anymore. I will probably still be suspicious of NASCAR but, not when it comes to drug testing.
Good thing Jeremy didn't maim or kill someone, on or off the track.
ReplyDeleteNo, instead he won races and was well-respected by his colleagues.
NRfan
ReplyDeleteWhen one is married 30 YEARS the WIFE KNOWS! he became too focused on things at the expense of family interactions. Music, working. At first she thought it was his passion for things..but after the third rehab over 15 yr period--and he went years of sobriety! TRUST ME she knew the signs. Also we are a smart bunch. Skeptical wenches maybe. :-) That helps.
I feel sorry for spouses totally duped. I know that does happen in cases where somebody's savvy and you can't smell it on them (like alcohol or smoking something)
Painful. In some ways, it's like an affair...only more powerful...in some cases.
But from what I saw of Jeremy and Shana on some documentaries, they seemed close...so that's why I think she had to know. If not now, she will in hindsight..if she is HONEST with herself.
That's the other part of addiction..you second guess yourself, deny yourself, think YOU are paranoid over spouses behavior. etc
Who know's what Shayna has been through though honestly.
But still from all the before and after pictures I have seen on tv and in print of those SMOKING METH, Jeremy does NOT FIT the norm. Usually you not only get bad skin but age rapidly. Even with good genes...Unless all those before and after pics we see are "Photoshopped" or Photo CHOPPED..and that's always a possibility.
I just hope Jeremy doesn't leap off a tall building.
With scandals, that's always a concern.
@ Dot...would never think those things about you :-). You are one of my favs on this site...read your comments to my husband.....
ReplyDeleteWe all like to believe the good in everyone. Unfortunately there are very "nice" people who don't "look" like...drug users, rapists, murderers, child abusers, etc.
Dot said; I don't want anyone to think, "Oh, there's lame Dot, typing out of her rear."
ReplyDeletelol Dot now I'll never read your posts without thinking that, but trust me it won't be in a bad way.
I like reading everyone's post even when we don't agree. After all they are just opinions and all are equally as valuable. The only ones I don't like is when someone disagrees and has to resort to calling everyone that disagrees with them names. Ever notice most on them are "annon"?
While Mayfelds lawyer says Aegis shouldn't have tested, the ARE a Federally accredited drug testing lab, the lab JM went to is not. Besides this time the "B" sample has not been opened, NASCAR is asking the court to which lab do they want to conduct the test.
When JM went to this Lab he had never been to before, how was that sample collected? was he in a private room he could use a sample he carried in? NASCAR doesn't have to accept that test, and the courts shouldn't allow it.
Very sad, very sad indeed.
Some of you are missing parts of the story. Mayfield's step-mother has a history with him. She once sabotaged his fan forum and has been causing problems for a couple years. I remember reading a year or two back about how she was threatening to sue him for money.
ReplyDeleteI also have a problem with the same lab doing the second test. Would that not be a conflict of interest considering the court documents are looking at the ill procedures of said lab? And if there are other samples tested by legit labs that came back negative, why are only the NASCAR tests coming back positive?
I find it very very very hard to believe Mayfield would 'cook his own meth'. First only dealers do something of that nature. It would not be hard to determine if he actually did so or not. The chemicals leech into the surrounding ground and are detectable for many years. Plus it is idiotic to think someone of his stature would resort to making his own meth instead of buying it.
I'm sorry, but I do not trust NASCAR completely on this situation. I harken back to what they did to Tim Richmond in the 80s and I'm not sure what would stop them from doing it again.
sophia....focus.....please. :)
ReplyDeleteJD
Jeremy Mayfield on Sirius:
ReplyDelete"Brian France talking about effective drug policy is like Al Capone talking about effective law enforcement."
I guess the gloves are off...wow.
JD
phathead
ReplyDeleteGREAT POINT about cooking your own stuff. That does put out quite the stench which is why many do it in rural areas! So i can believe he tested positive. Just NOT for as long as we are hearing.
And as noted HOW does NASCAR test the drivers? At the track, mailing it in service? In restroom stall with somebody listening.
WOW..I can't believe JM is going on radio at this point. Somebody needs to muzzle that boy.
ReplyDeleteWish there was a ustream for that.
Honestly at this stage in the game, what point is there in Mayfield fighting unless there is a legit reason?
ReplyDeleteIf I have learned one thing in the past few weeks is that that once the media writes something, it is taken at fact. I was a huge Steve McNair fan for many many many years. I watched his name drug through the mud by various media outlets regarding his death and on 'what type of person' he really was.
The thing is they totally mismanaged who McNair was. They only looked at this one incident and drew their own conclusions from there. McNair was one of the most stand up guys in the game who made a mistake in life, yet that is how he'll now be remembered.
Thus, I don't trust how some of this stuff is coming out. I certainly don't trust NASCAR in anyway because they have been known to manipulate circumstances, whether in the media or in races, to fit their needs.
Addicts lie. Addicts are the masters of covering things up. Addicts come in all shapes and sizes, professions, races, socio-economic levels and family structures. They know how to manipulate people.
ReplyDeleteThose of us who have dealt with family, friends and colleagues with this disease learn the hard way that when someone's actions and words don't make sense there is a reason.
Hopefully for Mayfield this is his rock bottom moment. He has the means to get the best treatment and accept that he is indeed an addict. I wish nothing but the best for him and his family and friends who have to learn how to live with an addict.
bevo - This is more than just lying though, that's the part that gets me. I work in pharmacy, I deal with addicts on a daily basis. If you mount up a large amount of evidence in their face, they eventually crumble.
ReplyDeleteEven so you do not call out an organization like this and threaten lawsuits if you don't have an axe to grind. That would be like Manny Ramirez threatening to go after Bud Selig and the MLB
I also have a problem with the same lab doing the second test.
ReplyDeleteI do, too.
I can't imagine a scenario in which the "new" test would have had a "negative" finding after NASCAR spent so much time arguing for the validity of the lab's previous tests.
Let's see a third-party test--one from a lab that doesn't have any previous ties to NASCAR.
(@dot: you can type out of your rear?!? wow, that is an uber-amazing talent!! )
ReplyDeleteall: step-mother's allegations are irrelevant: the science is what's key here. titillating, to be certain, but ultimately irrelevant.
phathead: aegis is nascar's lab; they have every right to continue to use aegis, especially since the issues that buric brought up (security of the sample, mayfield not witnessing all aspects of handling the sample, A and B sample both being opened, etc.) had been addressed in the 7/6 sample collection.
according to buric, labcorp hasn't finished the testing yet -- altho' buric claims the results are negative. not sure how that can be if the testing isn't finished yet.
and the B sample is still intact, waiting for the parties to agree on which lab should be used.
jd: here's my one "personal" comment in re: mayfield and his al capone/brian france statement: he continues to try to deflect from answering the hard questions and is now tossing out clever one-liners for the media to report and replay endlessly. "nothing up my sleeves! no need to watch my hands, folks! look over here instead." yeah, like that.
Phathead
ReplyDeleteIf you believe your own DENIAL/reality you will do the insanity it appears JM is doing on radio.
That's why they say denial is the first symptom.
Course I am not an addict, honest! :)
Mayfield's lawyers have got to get control of their client, because he sounds rather out of control to me. Frankly, I'm sick of this whole issue. We've got liars to the left and liars to the right. No one has been totally honest through this whole thing and NASCAR brought this on themselves. The unclear, flexible rules they created caused this.
ReplyDeletered - I don't care if they are 'NASCARs lab'. The fact of the matter is they did not follow proper procedures when testing it the first time (which could put them in danger of losing their federal status) so why would they be allowed to test it again? Why not find another major lab... say like the one the NFL or MLB uses?
ReplyDeleteAll NASCAR was doing there was opening up another avenue for dismissal.
Sometimes I feel like a bunch of drunken monkeys are running this sport.
Mayfield on the step-mom statement:
ReplyDelete"She's tried everything she can do to get money out of me. I won't help her, so I guess she found a way to get money from NASCAR by giving them an affidavit full of lies."
@phathead: to your question of why mayfield is fighting this so hard if he's guilty: no way any of us can know. but it's not as clear-cut as "he's fighting so hard so he must be innocent; otherwise, why go thru all this? and all these others who were busted haven't done it. so, he must be innocent."
ReplyDeletebut it doesn't work for me. individuals make individual choices and the motivations can't be known to us (and may not be fully known to the individual, either.) what ramirez or hmiel or bonds or any of them have chosen to do/not do doesn't apply to mayfield b/c every situation is different.
i don't know mayfield, i don't know his step-mother and wife. i can't speak to who's SAYING what. but the science is the science -- and, in my opinion, it's telling a very clear story.
I am so totally disappointed in Jeremy. I tried very hard to give that man the benefit of the doubt. But alas, he royally stuck it to those of us who were in his corner.
ReplyDeleteI nearly passed out when I read the comments by his step mother. Boy, she makes Teresa Earnhardt and her dissing of Jr and Kelly Earnhardt a great candidate for step mother of the year.
red - I'm not implying his innocent by any means, he could be very well guilty. Something about this whole thing doesn't seem right at all. I think both sides are lying their behinds off to some degree.
ReplyDeleteIn reality this is NASCARs fault. They have designed a crappy system with numerous faults which have put them in this position.
Phathead said...
ReplyDelete"red - I don't care if they are 'NASCARs lab'. The fact of the matter is they did not follow proper procedures when testing it the first time (which could put them in danger of losing their federal status) so why would they be allowed to test it again?"
b/c the issues that were raised in the injunction were clearly addressed in the subsequent collection. and buric isn't (yet) contesting the procedures used for the 7/6 collection.
i would ask buric to provide documentation that specifies how the sample was collected by labcorp one hour or so after the nascar sample. if he's concerned about the procedure, then shouldn't he be equally required to document correct procedure by his lab of choice?
To expand on Anon's 10:30 comment.
ReplyDeleteWhy would NASCAR pay step mom? Wouldn't that destroy their credibility? Jeremy is really reaching now. Will we be surprised when his attorney steps away from this case? No money to be made for him.
Just a thought. I wonder if the Jeremy deal had something to do with no NASCAR Wives ever being aired.
Thanks to all for your kind comments.
Who interviewed JM on Sirius?
ReplyDeleteDid they just let him VENT or ask him questions of SPECIFICITY.
Curious
ya know what i really like about TDP? we can discuss something as volatile as this without becoming jerks!
ReplyDeletephathead, i agree that nascar mishandled a fair amount of the procedural process but my question is: should that negate the scientific result? especially now that a second test has come back with the same results, a test run on a sample that was collected in such a way as to be sensitive to the issues raised in the injunction?
and let's not even get started on what happens if the B sample, tested by an agreed-upon lab, also comes up positive.
see, for me, the bottom line is that the original samples -- both A and B -- tested for a form of meth that is chemically different than anything in adderall or claritin-d or any combination of those 2 drugs. and now the A sample from 7/6 has tested positive for the same thing. that's the science of it that's being overshadowed by the colllection process. and since i'm just a fan and not a judge or lawyer, that's the part of this that i have chosen to focus on.
until mayfield's folks can explain that to me, the science trumps all the other stuff.
Assuming NASCAR and Jeremy's legal team can agree on a lab for the B sample, we should know a little more in the not so distant future. I'm very interested in what the reaction will be if the test comes back positive. Will Jeremy continue to deny, deny, deny, and accuse that lab of being in on the conspiracy? Likewise, if it comes back negative, could NASCAR ever admit they might have made an error?
ReplyDeleteI am still having a hard time buying this. Especially what the step-mother claims. If Jeremy had been using meth since 1999, his skin would be pock-marked, scarred, and he wouldn't have a tooth in his head, or he would be dead. Meth rots out the teeth. I live in a county where meth is rampant-believe me NO ONE survives 10 years of meth use.
ReplyDeleteBuddy Baker and someone else. They asked questions including "why would NASCAR single you out"
ReplyDeleteLots of venting from what they had said though
Phathead said...
ReplyDeleteWhen the judge said NASCAR could test Jeremy when ever they wanted as much as they wanted, did he say Aegis could not do the testing? You know, him knowing they were the ones hired by NASCAR?
As far as the improprieties of the testing in the first place, that is an accusation Mayfield has made, but it is NOT been proven in court yet that it was, the case has not gone to court yet so is not proven. As far as wanting to take the word of this other lab, it is NOT an accredited lab, but at this time Aegis still is.
I have read there are other sports that use one lab and that lab also tests both samples, so I'm not so sure Aegis has done anything wrong with their testing procedures. We won't know that until the case is actually heard.
In the mean time you're suggesting that a test be used that has had no over site by the parties involved by a non credited lab????
Something the media could have done to help this whole process is interview multiple addiction medicine doctors. Explain the basics of addiction. Get the point across that it is a disease process and not a reflection of moral character. Shame feeds on itself and makes an addict dig his heels in even further.
ReplyDeleteWhy would NASCAR pay step mom? Wouldn't that destroy their credibility?
ReplyDeleteI don't actually think she was paid--she could easily have done it out of spite.
But the idea of your defending NASCAR's alleged credibility is kinda of funny.
and now the A sample from 7/6 has tested positive for the same thing. that's the science of it
ReplyDeleteAgain, I cannot imagine a situation in which this particular lab--so highly touted by NASCAR--would come back with anything other than a positive result for this test.
That is why a test at a different facility is so important.
Heather I don't put much stock into what his step mom said, I don't know Why NASCAR would even use it.
ReplyDeleteI don't think NASCAR and Mayfield have to agree on a lab to use, the Federal court will pick one and send it to one completely independent of the 2 parties.
Is Aegis actually even a defendant? I don't think so, Mayfield sued NASCAR claiming they messed up on the testing procedures, of course Aegis actually did the testing.
But you know if they sued Aegis as it is the one that advised, set up and manage the drug testing program it wouldn't have the same support from so many that are so willing to blame NASCAR for everything wrong with the world.
So NASCAR took the names of 15 mediocre drivers, put 'em in Bill France's fedora, pulled out Jeremy's name, and decided to go after him? OK, for arguements sake I'll buy it. But why would they? What is the possible gain?
ReplyDeleteOk so NASCAR's lab says positive. Jeremy's lab negative. Both are a conflict of interest.
ReplyDeleteIf I were the judge I would recommend a 3rd party with NO interest in this, test NASCAR's sample, the LabCorp sample, and test Jeremy a 3rd time at their facility. Find out the results, and unquestionably answer this once and for all.
If you have to go into hair and DNA samples...well that may be the last resort.
Not every meth addict looks like a typically portrayed TV stereotype.
ReplyDeleteA lot of meth addicts take care of themselves, brush their teeth, eat healthy, exercise, do a good job at work etc, etc.
My son in law did it for nearly 10 years himself before his world crashed and burned around him too.
Great career, nice future...
Nobody knew, his wife,kids, nobody.
He had his odd quirks about him, but doesn't everyone? We all just figured that's Mark!
So don't be fooled by his good looks, pretty wife and decent career.
Looks aren't the only clues.
Jeremy's bubble hasn't completely burst yet, but that hole sure is getting a lot bigger and no amount of bare bond is going to fix this wreck.
Dave in Milw.
You don't pay anyone for an affidavit. It is sworn testimony given under oath and subject to penalties for perjury.
ReplyDeleteI am still disappointed that I have seen no one in the media compare the NASCAR program to that of any other major racing series and the only comparison I have seen to another major sport was by David Newton a couple of weeks ago where he noted that the NFL also has the B sample tested by the same lab.
ReplyDeleteIt does seem to me that there have been a couple of hints in the media that maybe there was suspicion that Mayfield might be guilty - Marty Smith's description of how agitated Mayfield became in talking to the media in the infield at LMS and later DW had an article where he noted that it would be good for the sport for anyone to come forward who had personal knowledge of Mayfield's guilt or innocense.
Given the timing, I am still mystified that no one in the media, especially at ESPN, made any sort of comparison of Mayfield's situation to those of Manny Ramirez or, especially, Sammy Sosa. The media pronounced Ramirez and Sosa as guilty and pariahs without question, and more worthy of being banned from the Hall of Fame than Pete Rose.
I do wonder whether Mayfield thought he might be able to bluff NASCAR into a settlement if he pushed back, and the initial media bashing of NASCAR's drug policy might have given him encouragement.
Guilty or innocent, it has always seemed to me that Mayfield erred early on by talking before he had an attorney.
You don't pay anyone for an affidavit. It is sworn testimony given under oath and subject to penalties for perjury.
ReplyDeleteNevertheless, people have perjured themselves for money in the past, as illegal as that may be.
Slater said...
ReplyDelete"So NASCAR took the names of 15 mediocre drivers, put 'em in Bill France's fedora, pulled out Jeremy's name, and decided to go after him? OK, for arguements sake I'll buy it. But why would they? What is the possible gain?"
ding, ding, ding! we have a winner! this is one of the points about this case that no one can explain to me. why in the name of all that is important to them as an organization would nascar deliberately repeatedly falsify a drug test result? what do they have to gain from that?
i can understand mayfield being less than honest: he has a whole lot at stake. but step back and ask: why would nascar "go after" mayfield in the first place? i'm not a nascar apologist in any form but c'mon: it's just not a rational scenario.
Dave
ReplyDeletethanks for the info..I always wondered if the bad skin and teeth was truly a side effect or just lack of hygiene due to addiction/depression/mental health problems strong addiction can make. Thus explaining my question of were pics Photoshopped.
JM has indeed opened his mouth to the media before.
My local news is doing sports and I just tuned in to see the JM story coming up next. They are using the STEP MOTHER quote that she has seen jeremy use 'more than 30 times'.
Also I thought I read on hair analysis, your hair has to be a certain length..Jeremy keeps a shaved look these days...
@eaglesoars
ReplyDeleteAegis was named as a defendant, as were NASCAR, Brian France, Aegis CEO Dr. David Black, Aegis Sciences Corporation and Dr. Doug Aukerman, who is the program's medical review officer.
So NASCAR is paying off Aegis to lie about tests, paying off a stepmom to lie under oath, what, to prove a point? To much grassy knoll stuff there. I cannot believe that Aegis would risk all credibility by getting caught up in this, not to mention possible crimal charges.
ReplyDeleteIn fact early in the season Mayfield could have been almost a poster boy for NASCAR - a reasonbly well-known person who was creating a new, independent Cup team despite the terrible economy. It seems to me that NASCAR had more reasons to want to protect Mayfield than to harm him. The "new" Mayfield team "proved" that NASCAR was alive and well, not dying.
ReplyDeleteWhat convinced me last year that NASCAR had to develop a new drug policy were the reports that no one suspected Fike of any drug problem before his arrest.
red,
ReplyDeleteYou obviously weren't standing in line to get your tinfoil hat before you commented.
To some, NASCAR is the evil giant, out to spread their pain and suffering to anyone who doesn't tow the company line, who doesn't kneel at the feet of the France family etc, etc.
OR...
Maybe Mayfield really is a tweaker and it's NASCAR's fault.
Dave in Milw.
Richard
ReplyDeleteI'd forgotten nobody suspected Fike BEFORE his bust. I remember the after since it happened 45 minutes from where I live in an amusement park parking lot.
I think NASCAR is sneaky but even this conspiracy theory (that they are out for JM) is hard to swallow. NASCAR may have a lot of problems but that is a huge stretch.
Sure many things don't add up except for the recent facts, as red and others have already said. And that's all NASCAR needed.
One botched test, i can buy. two can make me wonder the exact specific levels..but three tests wrong? Not a snowball's chance in hades.
For AEGIS to be willing to stand behind not one, not two, but three tests mean one of these things:
ReplyDelete1. Mayfield is using meth.
2. They are criminally negligent in their testing.
3. They took a bribe from Brian France and are willing to risk the fallout from such coming out into the open.
I can't see 3 being an option, and 2 is incredibly unlikely.
Add in the saga of the test delay and the testimony of the stepmother, I'd much rather be on the he uses limb than the conspiracy limb.
I guess I am too naive. I thought JM was innocent and a good lawyer could fix this. When I heard the meth levels tested were so high you could not function. I never once thought they were high because they were the levels of an addict. Not being able to find the testing lab last week was odd. GPS? Smartphone? Internet at home, library? All these could give directions or call the lab for directions.
ReplyDeleteI am naive enough to believe some excuses but as I read on I am learning that this is what addicts do. An excuse for everything.
We have run into JM & wife at the local cracker barrel. Don't go to the cracker barrel if you're high, it's not right.
Feel like I have been mugged, robbed for believing.
No longer believing.
kbaskins
ReplyDeleteThanks, I couldn't remember and I wasn't going to trudge back thru this mess to look it up. lol
Real point though is that the Judge issued the court order that NASCAR and Aegis COULD test JM often, so unlike some are saying that it is a conflict of interest obviously the judge didn't think so.
Slater, Red I agree it makes no sense to think NASCAR is targeting poor JM. Oh wait, that's what he's accused everyone else of in the past too.
Aegis isn't some hole in the wall drug lab, they are very big have impeccable credentials and have hundreds of businesses as clients. Just because someone makes accusations about them it does not mean they are guilty, this accusation has no science to back it up, but their accusation about Jeremy does.
Let's see ... the defendent does the testing that convicts the plaintiff ... have I landed in an alternate universe?
ReplyDeleteI wonder how the judge that lifted the injunction feels after today's news.
ReplyDeleteWe know there are lots of goofy/bad judges out there..but since he had to know more than most of us did, I am surprised he took the stance that he did.
"ding, ding, ding! we have a winner! this is one of the points about this case that no one can explain to me. why in the name of all that is important to them as an organization would nascar deliberately repeatedly falsify a drug test result? what do they have to gain from that?"
ReplyDeleteThey basically asked him that tonight on Sirius and his response was some hogwash about making an example out of him so that they wouldn't ever have to "out" one of their superstar drivers.
He also basically called Brian France a drug addict, "the pot calling the kettle black" I believe were his words.
Oh, and his evil step-mother murdered his dad and that will all come out Thursday in a civil suit he is going to file against her. Claims he's had private investigators working on that case for 2 years now.
The whole thing was a pathetic diatribe against the evil empire NASCAR and that "whore" step-mother of his that "doesn't deserve to have the Mayfield last name". Pathetic. But hey, you learn to expect that stuff from addicts.
The defendent in a civil case. Criminally they have done nothing wrong. If you can give me a good reason or two while Aegis or NASCAR would be out to get Mayfield, I'll sure listen. It seems that Aegis would lose many more clients if they were to be found falsifying a test than if they admitted to making an error on the test. And let's say France thru a million bucks at 'em, What is NASCARS gain?
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
ReplyDelete@Barry
ReplyDeleteYIKES! wish I would've heard that JM interview..he's not just throwing stones, he's throw concrete walls at NASCAR to throw out such allegations.
Spoken like a person still under the influence. Man..somebody better quiet the boy..this is ugly enough without dragging outing of drivers into this and calling BF names (but that's nothing new)
And his father was murdered? by the step mom?
This RADIO show needs to be played on some shows so we can hear the TONE of voice JM used. Mercy.
Sounds like a soap opera. Days of Our Lies. :(
There is one final thing to realize after this whole mess.
ReplyDeleteSomething is wrong with NASCARs system if we can all sit here and doubt, in anyway, the results they have given us.
Phathead
ReplyDeleteI know, I had many questions about NASCAR but it's like red & most of us feel: TRUTH (recent tests) TRUMPS everything.
NASCAR has questions of their own to answer (Precisely how they test, witnesses to sample,etc) Why not just screen EVERYBODY after what's transpired the last few years?
Obviously some of us know you can NOT tell by LOOKING and ACTIONS who is using/addicted until it's too late.
NASCAR was never good at PREVENTION though judging by their safety...it took several deaths to mandate HANS and SAFER barriers, yet latter STILL are not on every inch of the track but I digress.
But as I said to somebody else, Jeremy has done shot off his toes one at a time. And from what I hear he said on Sirius, it seems he's aiming towards his ankles now. Somebody needs to stop this freight train.
Want to know who REALLY has a great case if they want to claim wrongful termination?? Paul Chodora against Mayfield Motorsports! (Of course, good luck ever getting any money out of MMI.)
ReplyDelete--
THEN (2/19/09) -- "Mayfield Motorsports respects the decision by NASCAR to indefinitely suspend Paul Chodora," Jeremy Mayfield said in a statement issued Thursday. "We as an organization appreciate NASCAR's drug testing policies and policing efforts as it makes the sport stronger overall. If Paul doesn't comply with NASCAR's reinstatement process, then he will no longer be an employee of Mayfield Motorsports."
NOW (7/9/09) -- "I sit here listening to Brian [France] on a daily basis, defending their policy and talk about how thorough, accurate and fair it is. Then you turn right around and look at what, say, like, Dr. [Gary] Wadler, for example. Quote: 'Their policy is way, way behind those of other sports.'
"So you've got two of the most powerful anti-doping association policy leaders -- Dr. Wadler [and] Travis Tygart, the CEO of the U.S. Anti Doping Agency -- telling you that NASCAR's program fails to meet some, if not all, factors on a list of effective policies."
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
ReplyDeletePhathead, maybe there would not be so many questions if someone in the media had made the effort to compare NASCAR's program to that of other major racing series (like IRL, NHRA, and F1) early on before jumping to the conclusion that they were drug testing experts and commenced to bash NASCAR. I continue to believe that the issue has at least been handled sloppily by the major of the media. I read one article on a newspaper blog weeks ago right after Mayfield sued that accused NASCAR of countersuing Mayfield out of spite.
ReplyDeleteBarry
ReplyDeletethanks for the link. I never go to ESPN.
Richard in NC
A savvy comment there sums this case up.
"This story continues to spiral more and more into the twilight zone."
Indeed.
Who knows where this all ends. But that fact is that NASCAR's drug policies are shady and pathetic. We've all heard the testimony from Dr. Gary Wadler of the World Anti-Doping Agency. NASCAR needs to get it's act together and make a world class transparent testing system that will stand up in court so we don't have to waste time like this every time someone tests positive. Sometimes NASCAR having an iron-fist to rule it works great, sometimes they end up shooting themselves in the foot because of it.
ReplyDeleteMayfield has been sketchy since the beginning of this whole thing. And we all know how the "oh it wasn't me" thing plays out with every other athlete who has tested positive. I'd like to say "innocent until proven guilty" but I think Jeremy has reached the end of his rope on this one. His story just doesn't hold together and hasn't since the beginning.
However, that having been said, NASCAR relying on the word of a jilted stepmom is pretty pathetic. Not to mention the fact that her story is pretty bizarre. He cooked his own meth? Does anyone realize how amazingly nasty and dangerous that is? You can blow up yourself up if you aren't careful. HAZMAT teams have to come in and clean the place in big spaceman suits when they find a meth lab. We've got a big meth problem where I live and I've seen them gutting houses where a lab was. This isn't like growing a little weed at home. People with money just buy meth, they don't make it. Tweakers with no teeth make their own meth. Not to mention the fact that meth is a hard drug to hide once you are hooked. I don't know about you, but I've not met many people who do meth "once in a while". Meth is one of those drugs that gets its teeth in you and never lets go. Lives spiral out of control fast and there's no slowing that train. The fact that he is alleged to have had this problem for years and nobody knew about it other than the stepmom and a conveniently dead father? That's a little strange, don't you think?
And at the bottom of this is the fact that NASCAR knows full well that if it could just keep it's foot on Mayfield's throat long enough, no matter what the truth was Jeremy would eventually just go away. At this point, even if totally innocent, there is nothing he can do that will get him back in a race car. What's the worst that can happen now to NASCAR? He'll sue and win 10 million? Big deal. They are rid of him forever.
But the sad fact is that Jeremy probably does have a drug problem of some sort. After all, every other athlete who has tested positive has been a liar. Who would he be any different? We keep hoping that these men will turn out to be different, but we forget that they are mostly just little boys getting paid a ton of money to live a dream that most of us will never get to see. That sort of thing corrupts even the best of men and does unimaginable things to those less than the best.
However, Kudos to some of the NASCAR media for sticking with this story, particularly Marty Smith. From a purely outside view, it's been as interesting as any of the "testing positive" soap operas outside of Barry Bonds. Just a shame that it's a man's livelihood (and perhaps life) we're watching go down the drain.
Just finished reading Mulhern's transcript of JM's Sirius radio interview today. It reads like a person who has been backed into a corner desperate to convince the public he has been wronged. With the evidence piling up to the contrary, it will be interesting to see how this plays out.
ReplyDeletehttp://www.mikemulhern.net/index.php?q=breakingnow/it-all-over-jeremy-mayfield-nascar-files-damning-documents-courtbut-mayfield-fighting-ba
@Dot,
"Oh, there's lame Dot, typing out of her rear."
As one who visualizes everything, you slayed me with that comment.
Ok! It looks like he is done!!Now Nascar,Fans and friends need to try to help him!!This is all great media stuff,Lets burn him at the stake kind of thing,but he is going to need some help gang...Lets not push him over the edge!
ReplyDelete@ Lesley
ReplyDeleteObviously Mayfield doesn't believe he has a problem. It's hard for family and friends to help someone like that. Who's going to help? Shana? She's obviously an enabler. As we found out today, his father is dead. I guess his friends will have to step up.
But it doesn't matter who helps, until Mayfield stops being in denial, he's not going to kick this problem. And considering his diatribe on Sirius radio today, he's in no danger of admitting his addiction any time soon.
--KarenB
Deep in the Jenna Fryer article, Mayfield says that his stepmom (the one who claims under penalty of perjury in an affidavit that she saw him cook meth) blogs all sorts of lies about him and his wife.
ReplyDeleteBoy, I would love to read that blog! I bet it's filled with a bunch of stuff Jeremy doesn't want public. Can anyone dig it up?
NorCalFan,
ReplyDeleteThat's only a small part of the Sirius transcript.
Looks like Mulhern left out the really wacky accusations made by JM, such as his step-mom killed his dad, and that Brian France is also a user ("pot calling the kettle black").
"Can anyone dig it up?"
ReplyDeletehttp://blogs.reviewjournal.com/uncategorized/shana-mayfield-married-to-mayfield-motorsports
:)
Although I have never been a Jeremy fan, I have strong doubts about NASCAR's side. I think there will be a huge payout coming Mayfield's way in the future. Too many questions, too many holes.
ReplyDeleteMore of the Sirius transcript (this one includes the wild accusations):
ReplyDeletehttp://blogs.courant.com/autoracing/2009/07/getting-sirius-jeremy-mayfield.html
This is interesting. It's the court papers filed by NASCAR.
ReplyDeletehttp://www.4wide.com/uploads/docs/25937NASCARMayfieldfilingJuly15.pdf
A couple of things I noticed:
1) Mayfield originally said he got a voice-mail message from Aegis to take the drug test last Monday. Aegis' records show he talked directly to an Aegis rep. Twice. And was told the time frame.
2) If you look at Exhibit 3 (Black), you'll see what Aegis is testing for: Anabolic Steroids, Beta-Blockers, Diuretics and Amphetimine/Methampetimine. If you want to know what's on NASCAR's banned list, read through what shows up in the test results. It goes on for pages. Mayfield isn't smoking dope or snorting coke. There was "none detected".
3) The same Exhibit shows how the donor is anonymous.
4) Mayfield had an argument on the phone with his lawyer about the observed test. He absolutely refused to do it. I guess his lawyer talked some sense into him.
5) Read this quick article couched in layman's terms: http://stockcarscience.com/blog/index.php?cat=20
The author talks about what the d/l-amphetimine and methamphetimine numbers mean.
From the website:
"Here’s why the presence of two versions of the same molecule is important: If you take meth, it’s entirely d-methamphetamine. A number of other drugs contain molecules like pseudoephedrine, which are metabolized by the body and can produce amphetamine.
"For example, famprofazone, an over-the-counter med that’s found in some pain medications, produces equal amounts of the d- and l- forms of meth and amphetamine when it is metabolized in the body. So if the meth that is detected is due to use of this drug, then there should be comparable amounts of each version of the molecule."
Mayfield's sample contained both d- and l-ampetimines (in an 86%/13% split) but (and here's the important bit) only d-methampetimine. Anything else providing the positive result would have shown a split in the d/l-methamphetimine result, just like the d/l-amphetimine showed.
OK guys, sorry to geek out like this, but I was reading the court papers and wanted to know what the results meant and you're the ones who are paying the price for my curiousity. :-)
I'll stop now.
--KarenB
JD, OT, I have to compliment the posters on this blog. Such intelligent people and well-written comments. I've never seen another blog like this one. Thanks to you for keeping the ne'er-do-wells on a short leash. No wonder you were the top blogger last year.
ReplyDeleteThanks Karen, I do have one request please. Send me the links you feel fit this topic.
ReplyDeleteIf they are legally authorized to repost, I will put them on the web page as a one-click hyperlink.
Typing them in comments just puts me in a tough position. Either delete the entire comment or leave it with a link that might be spam or adware or a virus.
Just drop me an email at editor@thedalyplanet.tv if you have a page to link. Thanks.
JD
This whole situation is really sad. I think back on Jeremy's career, and the teams he left....it was never his fault. First, it was Rusty Wallace's fault for not sharing information. Then, it was Ray Evernham's fault for dating Erin. Isn't denial one of the red flags for addiction? Now, his step mother 'killed' his dad? Whatever is going on here, Jeremy has some real problems that he needs to address, whatever their cause.
ReplyDeleteJust wanted to add a comment regarding those who can't believe JM is using meth because he doesn't look like the typical user you see in documentaries and the movies.
ReplyDeleteHow many beautiful people (actors, musicians, athletes) have we seen with drug problems? Those stereotypical pictures of toothless, physically ravaged bodies we see in the media may actually occur but they aren't necessarily the norm. There are more functional addicts walking around than dysfunctional addicts.
As for not believing that he could manufacture his own without someone knowing, remember he was only making enough for himself. Once again the stereotype is that of a guy living in a trailer with empty chemical containers laying everywhere and a constant chemical stench in the air. Also add in the fact that he probably lives on a large parcel of land with no immediate neighbors around to smell it (I am only assuming this because I remember seeing him on a tractor plowing up a field a couple of years ago)
I'll be honest - I believe Jeremy Mayfield.
ReplyDeleteNASCAR still refuses to have an INDEPENDENT lab test a Mayfield sample. Until it does, I have to believe that NASCAR will do anything it can - legal, illegal, moral, immoral -- to save it's own skin. I've seen it before, and I'll say it again -- NASCAR is a family business, and the "family" will stop at nothing to protect itself.
Not that Mayfield is a choirboy - he had some issues in the past. But digging up a stepmother who has an axe to grind.....that's pretty low.
I agree with all those who bring up denial with Mayfield. It seems to me that maybe if he has a problem he's not fighting to prove that he's innocent as much as he's fighting to not have to admit to a problem and have to deal with it by getting clean. Nate Ryan, Jenna Fryer, David Newton and some others in the NASCAR media are doing some excellent work on what can't be an easy story to cover given the issues involved. Mayfield seems determined to have this continue to be a circus and I suspect this sad story will likely only continue to get sadder.
ReplyDeleteI don't know if Mayfield uses meth or not. In talking to people that have dealt with those that use it, it would be obvious whether a person has been on meth for some time. Mayfield does not appear to be the typical user just based off his appearance.
ReplyDeleteHaving said that, I think he's doing something he ought not be doing whether it be meth or something else. I'm not going to come out and say that he is just because of the tests. But it seems pretty obvious.
I would like for this circus to be over soon. I'm tired of hearing about it. The way Mayfield keeps throwing people under the bus doesn't sit well with me. But that seems pretty typical of him.
I'm still not sure who to believe, although I seem to be one of a few exceptions as most it seems believe Nascar. Come on, did you really think that the Aegis test would be negative this time? Wouldn't that have shot their current appeal in the foot? 7 days for results seem a little long, but I guess they were double/triple checking. Doesn't it seem convenient that the test results are filed with the court seemly at the last minute since yesterday was the last day for Jeremy's lawyers to file their answer to Nascar's appeal?
ReplyDeleteI also think that neither Nascar's or Jeremy's tests should be considered. Seems like a conflict of interest with both parties. I wish that Judge Mullen had ordered the testing to be done by a court appointed lab - that way there wouldn't be any question, in my mind at least. Just my opinion.
JD said "It may well be that Mayfield's attorney is just as surprised as many readers."
ReplyDeleteI'd be surprised if the lawyers didn't test a hair sample before agreeing to represent JM.
Clients have been known to lie.
Anon @8:25 I agree with the gist of your post, although I have remarked this is not about Mayfield, and I don't carry any water for him. It's about authority and the serious challenge to it.
cvt,
ReplyDeleteMahyfield said he has been taking a drug test every three or four days since the first test without telling NASCAR.
He says he has clean tests since the NASCAR test and clean tests even after NASCAR's second test.
That is going to make it interesting.
JD
JD,
ReplyDeleteMy point is these are not incompetent lawyers who didn't realize who & what they were going up against. I'd like to see one of the intrepid journalists ask Bill Diehl "did you test JM before you agreed to represent him?"
Diehl would want to satisfy himself first.
NASCAR knew they were losing the public pr battle. This announcement has reversed that,whether it ultimately proves accurate is another matter.
ReplyDeleteThe proof is in the posts to this thread. Sad, in my opinion.
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
ReplyDeleteI know, I had many questions about NASCAR but it's like red & most of us feel: TRUTH (recent tests) TRUMPS everything.
ReplyDeleteI won't believe the testing is accurate (i.e., the truth) until ti is done at an independent lab not associated with this case...or NASCAR.
Why is that such a hard thing to do, by the way?
Unless they're afraid an indy lab will come up with different results.
If France is doing drugs as Mayfield alledges it's really comparing apples to oranges since Brian doesn't race a car at 200 mph....of course it could explain some of the things NASCAR has done in the last few years.
ReplyDeleteRegardless, throwing everyone "under the Bus" reeks of a last desparate attempt of an addict to sway people.
As for the people who keep saying Mayfield doesn't look like a meth addict --- the rotten teeth and such. Those may be attributes of a person who smokes meth, but those who snort reportedly do not. (Which is what the step-mom testified to.) I also wonder if NASCAR had additional ammo as in her testimony, she says others also saw him do it. I'm sure she's told NASCAR who those others are and I would imagine that a lawyer did due diligence in checking that out.
Anon 9:53AM,
ReplyDeleteI appreciate your point of view. The word final was in reference to NASCAR's view of what a second positive test for meth would mean.
No need to do a third, this second test makes it final.
Not quite sure how that makes it sensational. Trust me, in terms of NASCAR, this is over.
As you know, our discussion has been talking about Mayfield and the media. This is the only way fans are getting information about this issue.
I hope you think we are doing our job by posting these kinds of columns and asking fans to comment.
JD
I have not read all of the comments so if I am repeating, I apologize.
ReplyDeleteAccording to JM and his lawyer, other tests have shown negative. If that is the case, then this story is not over.
Trying to get some info from ESPN about who will be on NASCAR Now tonight at 5PM on ESPN2.
ReplyDeleteThat should be a show to remember.
JD
"According to JM and his lawyer, other tests have shown negative. If that is the case, then this story is not over."
ReplyDeleteIf that wre to be true why are these "tests" that are negative not being released to the public. And why is he saying he tested negative now and not before his second test came out. Face it Jeremy, you were caught. Its time to face the music. As much as a good guy he may be, his career is over.
With NA$CAR's track record of compulsive lying, I don't trust them. Nor do I completely trust Mayfield. He does seem to have something figured out though(if in fact he is a long time addict as NA$CAR claims), because he just doesn't look like a Meth head. If he is a habitual user, he should sell his secret to other users, because he is the only Meth addict ever (over 10 years of Meth use according to his stepmom) to be able to keep his looks intact (still have teeth-meth causes your mouth to secrete less saliva causing more bacterial growth in you mouth thus tooth decay,it has nothing to do with smoking or snorting it, and be somewhat fat-when you are high on Meth you don't eat, sometimes for days). No long time Meth user in the history of Meth has managed to stay as "healthy looking" as Mayfield has. Until we see the results of a court appointed independant lab test hair and or blood samples, we just cannot believe either side right now. For all of the media (you too JD) to now automatically say that Mayfield is 100% guilty of Meth use because the same lab that messed up the first time doing another test, is just wrong. What ever happened to innocent until proven guilty in a court of law? In order for NA$CAR to have any credability in this, they should have gone to Mayfield's house and collected a hair sample and sent it off to a completey different lab to be tested and not use their family friends over at Aegis again. No matter what, this whole drama is WAY more interesting than the racing is in NA$CAR nowadays
ReplyDeleteAs a former teammate of his, I would be very curious to hear what Rusty Wallace has to say about this...
ReplyDeleteYes, Mayfield says he has clean tests, but if you read the court papers, NASCAR says that the labs Mayfield is using and the labs suggested by his attorney do not have the ability to test for all three of the drugs at issue - meth, Addrall and Claritin-D. The labs Mayfield wants can't test for Claratin-D, which means they are doing a most basic test, unlike Aegis' complex testing (which is laid out in the court papers linked from the USA Today article).
ReplyDeleteCan someone find the blog of Mayfield's stepmom? He says she has a blog filled with lies about him. I bet!
Photojosh said... I do not believe NASCAR'S drug policy is "shady or pathetic" . I believe people that think that are the ones that are always flying black helicopters over anything they can against NASCAR.
ReplyDeleteNow does it need some tweaking? Obviously it does, and I'll bet you every lab that conducts drug tests and every administrator of a drug program are watching this case very closely because I'll bet almost every drug testing policy in the US will be tweaked after this. This is far more reaching than just to the little NASCAR circle.
Exactly what do you know the rest of us don't that makes you know with certainty that "NASCAR's" drug program is "Shady & Pathetic"? What do you think of the NFL drug program, seems their one lab tests both samples and no one questions it? These labs are independent entities, their credentials are impeccable, they have NO vested interest if a person tests positive or negative to their tests. The idea that a lab like this would for some reason take a payoff from a client to "burn" someone is absurd. No self respecting person would take a piddly payoff, even a couple million would be piddly compared to selling out and destroying their business, killing all the respect and credibility’s they worked their life building and losing all self respect gained over a case like this? Are you seriously suggesting that?
I'd also like explained what is shady and pathetic to hire one of the top drug testing labs in the country to advise you, set up and administer a drug testing policy for your business? As far as what some other Dr. said about Aegis's methods wouldn't stand up in court, How do we know, it hasn’t gone to court yet? Has any reporter bothered to look up and see if Aegis methods being challenged in court before this? Remember this guy is a Dr, not a lawyer or judge so that is only his opinion and should not be considered any stronger than that. Fact is, he is a competing drug testing Lab to Aegis. In the US Dr Black is considered an authority in drug testing also, so what we have are 2 scientist disputing methods. There is really nothing unusual about that.
Which brings to mind the stupid statement JM made last week to Marty Smith: "Why would you call a toxicologist if you're on medications?" he said. "How is he qualified to tell you what prescriptions you can take and can't take? Dr. Black is not a medical doctor. He's not qualified to tell any driver out there, if they call him, what prescriptions they can take and can't take. Fact." Well DUH who do you think should be running a drug testing lab, a Podiatrist? That's exactly what a toxicologist does. Dr Black don't tell you what you can and can't take, but he can tell you what it does to your system. I also don't understand the confusion over the policy and that there is no specific list. This is a no tolerance for drug abuse policy. They are not telling you what prescription drugs you can or can not take, that is why drivers are supposed to inform the lab what prescriptions they are taking #1 and provide a copy of the prescription to the lab so they know they prescribed dosage. Which by the way, Jeremy had failed to do prior to failing the test, and then it was "Oh yeah by the way". So from the very beginning Jeremy was playing the system and refusing to follow the rules of the policy. IMHO.
We’re all wasting our time thinking and talking about Mayfield. He’s history. He’s done. His career is over, and now he’s just lashing out in all directions. Let’s talk about something racing related, not a habitual liar and drug addict who will soon be the answer to a trivia question, at best.
ReplyDeleteOk,
ReplyDeleteI've been in sales for a long time, and have known people that have drug problems. Even some meth users that are in the same type of business that I am in, and guess what...you would never guess they had a problem. Neat in appearance, good teeth. They took extra care to not look the part.
Now on to the second point. Aegis is holding the B sample for indepedent testing, so I see no problem here.
Under the provisions of my job, I can be called upon to provide a urine sample at any time, and have in the past. Every time, there was a monitor in the room where the sample was given and secured, to make sure that someone didn't cheat and have someone else sample. When it was sealed I was required to sign the tape, that stated that it was collected, and was indeed my sample.
As for the stepmom, Jeremy now says that he is going to go after her with a wrongful death suit. Is this not intimidating a witness?
My guess is that NASCAR has done due diligence and this is only the tip of the iceburg, and probably has more people that they can bring up to say that they saw or partied with Mayfield.
Mayfield is a junkie, pure and simple.
I agree with Richard in NC,
ReplyDeleteThe coverage of this mess has been dreadful. No comparisons to other sports' testing procedures. No comparisons to other workplaces' testing procedures (my mother recently retired from managing the safety dept. for a trucking company -- she told me that not showing up for a test was an automatic failure and dismissal just like refusing a breathalizer is an automatic admission of guilt for drunk driving). Nothing, except for one blog speciallizing in the science of racing, about the science of drug testing, the difference between a screening test and a thorough analysis, and just how false and true positives can be distinguished.
Instead of the responsible journalists digging into that stuff, the segment of the Nascar media that makes its living not by reporting on the sport but rather by bashing Nascar in general and Brian France in particular set the tone of the coverage.
One has to wonder what might have been different about the coverage if we still had David Poole with us.
What do you think of the NFL drug program, seems their one lab tests both samples and no one questions it?
ReplyDeletePerhaps because the NFL has a very strong players union that is the counterbalance to issues like this. The NFL can't just run roughshod over it's players and have secret "there are things you can't take but we aren't going to tell you what they are" lists.
Comparing the NFL and NASCAR in terms of drug policies is not very helpful. At least not until there is a drivers union. Which there won't ever be.
No self respecting person would take a piddly payoff, even a couple million would be piddly compared to selling out and destroying their business, killing all the respect and credibility’s they worked their life building and losing all self respect gained over a case like this? Are you seriously suggesting that?
Here's a fun game, replace the idea of "taking a payoff" with "taking drugs" and see how silly that statement sounds then. We all know people do absurd things for money. Am I saying that the lab is sketchy? No, I obviously have no proof of that. Just that anyone who thinks that "reputation" is going to keep people from doing things for money is living in a fantasy land.
But the bottom line is that a more than one of the nations foremost anti-doping experts have said "hey NASCAR, you've got some problems with your testing". You can say "what's he know, he's just a doctor" all you want, but the fact is that these guys are respected in their fields and their words carry weight. Was I engaging in some rhetoric or exaggeration by saying "shady and pathetic"? Probably, but my point was made.
And I stand by my opinion NASCAR's testing policy needs some serious improvement. It also needs to be straight forward and transparent or we are going to run through this sort of thing every time we have a positive result.
Regardless of who is right, and who is wrong, this whole thing gives me tired head.
ReplyDeleteI am skeptical of NA$CAR and their methods, not just relating to drug testing, but other areas as well.
I am not a big JM fan, but honestly, I would like this thing to play it's course and hopefully he is proven innocent.
I am reminded of the whole Tim Richmond debacle of years ago. It smacks of the same types of handling.
The biggest question I have, and have not seen it addressed, is that if he has been tested as many times as claimed, why are we not seeing those results? Rather it seems we are only hearing about this specific test or that specific test. I want to see/hear about all of them before I make up my mind.
What baffles me, as a reasonably sane, intelligent person is just exactly how, if you know you're doing meth, do you figure that you can pee in the cup and everything is gonna be fine.
ReplyDeleteAs I say when I hear stories of people robbing banks with notes written on the back of one of their own deposit slips, "How did you think that was gonna turn out, Sparky?"
Either Jeremy is a bull-goose loony, or NASCAR's got some quality control issues.
With regards to his comments regarding Brian France, it's pretty common knowledge around here in Daytona that Brian has a bit of a substance abuse issue himself. His is just a legal one...
>And I stand by my opinion NASCAR's
ReplyDelete>testing policy needs some serious
>improvement.
I keep hearing this, but the people saying it never provide the substantial improvements needed.
You mention "transparency", but I think you are only talking about from the fans' perspective, as there has been full transparency in regards to Mayfield and the way he has been dealt with. The only lack of transparency has been with information given to the fans and others not involved -- but changing that part of the program doesn't make NASCAR's drug testing program more effective. It doesn't catch more drug users.
So, again, what are the "serious improvements" you would like to see to NASCAR's policy? Do you really have anything, or just blanket criticism of NASCAR?
We don't know 100% of the fact. We only know 50% of the story. The rest is locked up in court documents and medical records. It seems that there were no reporters or public allowed into the court room. I say let it go to the jury and see what happens.
ReplyDeleteI think the judge should have appointed an independent lab to do the test and not NASCAR go back to Dr. Black. I also would order a court psychiatrist for good measure.
How often have you've gotten voice mail or text messages on your phone a day late or not at all? NASCAR should have sent someone the day before and the day after.
Why didn't NASCAR's lawyers bring Mayfield's step mom up before the injunction was granted?? Brian France and his lawyers really underestimated the judge in this case. This also speaks of their over confidence in dealing with the courts and shows their stupidity. It should have occurred to them that there was a slight chance they would lose, after all many prominent anti-doping agencies were speaking out against NASCAR's drug policy.
You know, Brian France, there is nothing to be ashamed of to ask for help when crafting a drug policy. It takes a big man to ask for help, especially if it makes them look foolish. I'm sure he would have gotten lots of advice, it doesn't mean he needed to take it, but it's nice to have in handy.
Interestingly, and this may have been covered by others, but if you look at Mayfield's statement when one of his crew members was banned earlier this year because of a failed test:
ReplyDelete"STATEMENT: The following is a statement from driver/owner Jeremy Mayfield of Mayfield Motorsports regarding Paul Chodora, who was found to be in violation of the NASCAR substance abuse policy: “Mayfield Motorsports respects the decision by NASCAR to indefinitely suspend Paul Chodora. We as an organization appreciate NASCAR's drug testing policies and policing efforts as it makes the sport stronger overall. If Paul doesn’t comply with NASCAR’s reinstatement process, then he will no longer be an employee of Mayfield Motorsports.”(Mayfield Motorsports/Co-Pilott PR)(2-19-2009)."
Ya know it's always "different" when things happen to you. So who knows in all of this but there has been some suspicious and odd behaviors from Jeremy for a long long time. That doesn't make him guilty but he surely is out there. All I can say is that if all of this comes out and it is indeed true there will be egg on a lot of media folks' faces who wanted to blast NASCAR and its process. That's been a lot of the arguments as others have posted here on this blog. NASCAR didn't do this or that or this or that. But what about the tests? I think the judge likely has egg on his face today too. NASCAR has done some dumb things lately in this sport but to pile on just because they are a bit stupid in putting on the show is a bit dumb. I wouldn't want to see "the list" that NASCAR is compiling now of media types that went off the reservation, I mean to hang your own credibility on Jeremey Mayfield is a bit misguided you might say. So there is a lot of folks in that pool today. It's not over by any means. And I wonder too if more can be made of the lab guy earlier that took a position against NASCAR, the one that said he didn't want any more to do with this deal, the one that the lawyers say they "inadvertently" forgot to delete his false credentials. Ewwww. To me there is some lawyer misconduct there...Any one ever heard of Duke LaCrosse? It seems like you can't trust anyone when it comes to winning...Of course they do represent Gloria Pace King too.
Photojosh said...
ReplyDelete??? what does a players union have to do with the ability of a lab to perform a test??
The fact is other sports have the same lab test both samples. Because of your dislike for NASCAR you are over looking the fact that Aegis is one of the highest accredited labs in the country with impeccable credentials and integrity and will throw them right down the tube for someone that over the years has proved has NO integrity.
Believe what you want I'm certainly going to agree to disagree.
genegirl99 said...
ReplyDeleteYou know, Brian France, there is nothing to be ashamed of to ask for help when crafting a drug policy. It takes a big man to ask for help, especially if it makes them look foolish. I'm sure he would have gotten lots of advice, it doesn't mean he needed to take it, but it's nice to have in handy.
July 16, 2009 12:25 PM
Isn't that what he hired Aegis Labs and Dr. Black to do, as well as administer it?
The first thing to remember is how much of the media is dependent on NASCAR and as such are willing to go along with their agenda, consciously or not. The second thing is we do not know if Aegis Labs every looked for a false positive the first time around or if they have since changed their testing protocols to include checking for false positives. Science does lie sometimes if you don't know what you're doing or what you're looking for.
ReplyDeleteAs to the step-mother, she has her own ax to grind with Mayfield, so I'd take whatever she says with a grain of salt.
Something else to consider in this whole thing. Since the media is focused on the Mayfield drama, they're not paying attention to the more pressing issues of exactly what is wrong with the sport itself. It's also taken the heat off of NASCAR over the Carl Long debacle.
We haven't seen all the test results and don't know the rest of the story as Paul Harvey would say. So don't go jumping the gun quite yet and condemning Mayfield. NASCAR has been known to "play dirty" in the past when a driver or team owner questioned their authority or rocked the boat.
"So, again, what are the "serious improvements" you would like to see to NASCAR's policy? Do you really have anything, or just blanket criticism of NASCAR?"
ReplyDeleteOh I don't know, let's see...how about "here is a list of banned substances" just for starters? The whole "we're testing you but we're not telling you what for" thing is pretty low-rent don't you think?
Or what about the fact that (according to what I've read) when tested at the track, drivers/crew members are allowed to use a bathroom stall for privacy. Anyone remember Onterrio Smith and the "Whizzinator"? Every serious testing program makes you fill that cup while someone is watching. Embarrassing perhaps, but it gets the job done. (For those who don't mind a little bathroom humor and funny photos, the NFL's Chris Cooley has a blog post about this very subject on his "shutdown-corner" site that you can google for. I won't put a link here because some might not find it appropriate.)
I was stoked in 2008 when NASCAR stepped up to the plate and announced random drug testing. Drugs have no place in NASCAR. I'm a fan and I want NASCAR to be as safe and as exciting and as successful as possible. However, this whole Mayfield mess has shown that their system needs some help. It's making NASCAR look like the keystone cops out there. Compare that to when Manny got caught the other month. Tested-caught-banned. Bingo. None of this voicemail/bad-directions/injunctions/claritin/etc stuff.
NASCAR can and should do better.
Can someone, anyone in the Media do an investigative report on this issue? How about including how drug tests are performed, including a walk through the procedure at an accredited lab. Also include various sports and their policies.
ReplyDeleteAlso, haven't seen it mentioned here, but in the Sirius interview, Jeremy said he took a test before and after the NASCAR test. The first one he went to an Urgent Care facility and the second one at an Emergency room. Mama Mia!!
eaglesoars said...
ReplyDeletegenegirl99 said...
You know, Brian France, there is nothing to be ashamed of to ask for help when crafting a drug policy. It takes a big man to ask for help, especially if it makes them look foolish. I'm sure he would have gotten lots of advice, it doesn't mean he needed to take it, but it's nice to have in handy.
July 16, 2009 12:25 PM
Isn't that what he hired Aegis Labs and Dr. Black to do, as well as administer it?
July 16, 2009 12:47 PM
I mean when starting the program, ask other sport series how they do it and then tailor it to NASCAR's needs. Then tuck in other nuggets of advice you get in the back of your head for the future when you need to update the program.
??? what does a players union have to do with the ability of a lab to perform a test??
ReplyDeleteYou are mixing up two different points. You said that people don't throw away their reputation by doing something stupid. I pointed out that they obviously do. It is well withing the scope of possibility that someone could and would take a payoff to falsify things. If you think that hasn't happened in sports, you live in a fantasy land.
In all reality, there is likely nothing wrong with Aegis as a lab. You are right, they are a respect lab and appear to do good work. I suppose a mistake could have been made in this specific case, mistakes happen. But far more likely they are just basing their work on what NASCAR tells them to do. Aegis follows NASCAR's set policy for testing.
And that is where the issue and where the idea of a players union comes in. The NFL (or MLB or NHL etc) can't just make up whatever it wants for a drug policy and administer it (or change the rules) however it wants. The players union holds a lot of power and things must be worked out between the league and the union. This has it's good points and bad points, change is slow to come but things tend to be more transparent and balanced when they finally happen. Now, the other side of that is that the players then take some of the blame for not addressing the problem, like when it became obvious that steroids were a problem in MLB. But that's a discussion for another day.
In comparison, NASCAR can do whatever it wants because they run the show. This is great for things like changing the rules mid-season and adding double-file restarts or green-white-chekers, but bad for crafting and administering something like a successful drug policy. The whole "the rules are secret and we're not telling" is a bad idea and leads to stuff like we've got with Mayfield.
Even if Mayfield is a full on liar, he can use that secrecy and confusion to play the public and juries through the media. If he gets enough people buying into the "NASCAR conspiracy theory" then he's got a chance of winning.
Hmmm, Area 51, The Grassy Knoll, 9-11, Paul is Dead, Landing on the Moon,Jeremy Mayfield v. NASCAR.
ReplyDeleteMakes perfect sense.
What do you think about Mayfield's mystery tests? Any ammo in having negative tests done by another lab?
ReplyDeleteWhat do you think about Mayfield's mystery tests? Any ammo in having negative tests done by another lab?
ReplyDeleteMaybe, in terms of a lawsuit or simple public perception. But in reality, his only real bet is to get something like a hair test done at at least one other legit respected lab. Perhaps more than one. Or another lab AND at Aegis and have them both come back clean Let's face it, guilty or not, he's out of racing. The smallsponsor.com guy's comments about a "fortune-500 level sponsor" notwithstanding, who is going to sponsor Jeremy? He's tainted with being a meth head (or, worse, he is one). As far as on the track, I think it's "put a fork in him" time. Shane Hmiel has probably got a better chance of getting back into racing than Mayfield does after this is all said and done.
What I'm hoping for is that this whole mess will get NASCAR to revise their testing policy and bring it up to the level that cycling, olympics, and the other major sports have for their testing so we can avoid this circus in the future. Do we really want a nightmare like someone cheating their way to a clean test with the Wizzanator and then have their drugs turn out to be the cause of a death on the track?
Bringing in mean ole step mommie does not give Nascar any credibility. There are obvious issues there & Nascar should not drag her into this circus. Let the test results speak. JM is self destructing with his Radio interview & the comments about Brian France. This story is not about France.
ReplyDeleteReminds me of why he was let go from Everham/Penske. Nothing was ever JM fault.
"So, again, what are the "serious improvements" you would like to see to NASCAR's policy? Do you really have anything, or just blanket criticism of NASCAR?"
ReplyDeleteOh I don't know, let's see...how about "here is a list of banned substances" just for starters? The whole "we're testing you but we're not telling you what for" thing is pretty low-rent don't you think?
Actually, I don't think so at all, and I have been more than satisfied with the reasons for not providing a list. By providing a list, you are only giving the serious user a list of what to avoid. You open up legal loopholes when someone uses something not on the list that can impair their driving.
The drivers know what they can and cannot take. If Mayfield had only taken Claratin-D that would have been fine. He maybe could have even taken his Adderall if he followed company policy and disclosed it ahead of time and had a valid Rx and not something from a health spa. But I don't see how NASCAR telling drivers "Don't smoke meth, it's on out list" changes ANYTHING. Are they going to put Elmer's glue on the list? And if they don't and they catch a driver huffing glue or shoe polish (it happens), then what? Or what if Sudafed isn't on the list and then you have a guy like Mayfield who was allegedly using the Sudafed to cook his own batch?
The policy is simple and clear: We will see everything that goes into your system, so make sure there isn't anything that isn't supposed to be there. Simple and effective. I don't think the drivers are up late with a headache wondering whether or not they should pop an Advil lest they be suspended like Mayfield. And I don't think that they need a list of hardcore drugs to know not to use them.
This whole thing about a list is a diversion. How about this: Be clean! Like when they interviewed Kasey Kahne, I loved his response: "I don't really need a list. I pretty much just eat hot dogs and sandwiches and drink a cold Bud every now and then, so why do I need a list?"
Furthermore, I don't see how a list is a "serious improvement" on the policy. Does it catch more drug users? Does a list make drivers safer? Puh-leaze. Try again.
ReplyDeleteWest Coast Diane
ReplyDeleteUrgent care and ER rooms? Wow, I did not know one could hire them for drug test. Mama Mia indeed!
JD
re: other tests..Depends on how they are carried out. Unless you see liquid leave the body in a cup, you can NOT be sure to whom the specimen belongs. Even with a partial door there are garments that hold somebody's clean urine to your body and sounds like you are going.
The more I read the more I am beginning to hear Twilight Zone music.
I am kind of tired of the extrapolation tho am guilty of that by posting here.
Thanks for the outlet, JD
What do you think about Mayfield's mystery tests? Any ammo in having negative tests done by another lab?
ReplyDeleteJD, I think they are either non-existent or not sufficient tests.
Mayfield did file a response to NASCAR and their response did not include any negative tests as evidence. They can say it all they want, but they didn't enter any into the record.
Furthermore, NASCAR outlines pretty clearly in their argument that the labs and testing done by the labs Mayfield wants to use and has been using are insufficient to detect the drugs he claims he was on.
There is a difference between a "drug test" where you run a scan on a sample and the lab says "positive or negative" and a complete screening, where a variety of tests are conducted, particles are isolated and identified, and the sample is broken down in a very complex way.
Again, we have had no context given by the media. To them, all drug tests are the same. To think that is to be completely ignorant of the type of testing and the sophistication of the testing done by Aegis.
I found one item very interesting the affadvit submitted by Aegis in this latest round. In it, Dr Black says that Aegis has been using the testing method they currently use for identifying meth for more than 15 years. In that time, he says they have identified more than 7,000 positive samples in their work for various agencies and sports programs. Of those 7,000 tests, there has never been a false-positive. He goes on to explain with some scientific mumbo-jumbo that is over my head exactly why they are able to be so sure. See page 12 of this PDF:
http://i.usatoday.net/sports/motor/nascar/s090715_mayfield_filing.pdf
Photojosh said...
ReplyDeleteNO, you are wrong, my original question was this;
What do you think of the NFL drug program, seems their one lab tests both samples and no one questions it?
And your answer was because they have a strong players union, so I was wondering what the heck that had to do with the capabilities of one lab being capable of doing both tests.
I can't wait to see Mayfield's reality-documentary!
ReplyDeleteDoes anyone remember the show "Breaking Bonaduce"? It was a reality show in which Danny Bonaduce had cameras follow him around for a few months to show what his life was life. But since he was practically a junkie, he didn't realize how bad he came off and the whole show - which he himself put together - ended up being a testimonial to how messed up he was.
When I read the various descriptions in the court documents about Mayfield's contentious, profanity-laced refusal to take drug test in his own home, and then I read that the whole thing was filmed by cameras he hired -- all I can think of is this Danny Bonaduce show. That sounds like a scene right out of it -- I can just see it now, Mayfield ranting and raving and the viewers at home thinking "wow, that guy is really coming unglued!"
JD asks,
ReplyDelete"What do you think about Mayfield's mystery tests? Any ammo in having negative tests done by another lab?"
In a court of law? Not unless the lab uses the same methods (GC/MS) and the same threshold levels. I think even Jeremy's lawyer has admitted as much.
In the court of public opinion? I think it would give the "true believers" and the black helicopter crowd ample evidence Jeremy is clean and "the man" is still out to get him.
The truth (which in this case is the science) will eventually win. Even a sitting president (Bill Clinton) had to concede he was lying when the science backed him into a corner.
genegirl99 said... I mean when starting the program, ask other sport series how they do it and then tailor it to NASCAR's needs. Then tuck in other nuggets of advice you get in the back of your head for the future when you need to update the program. July 16, 2009 1:10 PM
ReplyDeleteWhy would you go to a completely different type of sport that are testing for totally different things and drugs and ask questions they probably want to know some answers on too? Aegis is a company that goes into sports and businesses looks at their needs and helps create the program needed. I don't see anything wrong with the system NASCAR has, and I would have no problems competing under their rules.
There's some pretty important things being overlooked here IMO. You can not compare NASCAR to any of the stick in ball sports, for one the same hazards do not apply, but far bigger issue than that would be the organizational set up of the 2. The charters that organize the other sporting activities are totally different be cause NASCAR comes under free enterprise. It is a privately owned and privately held corporation. NASCAR is not really a sport, it is a trade name the same as Wal-Mart, Sears, Shell, Mobile etc. is, they just happen to be in the business of organizing stock car bodied auto racing events, being the sanctioning body to write and enforce the rules to "THEIR" business. So the rules that apply to NASCAR would be the same rules that apply to privately owned corporations, and actually they would be considered a small corporation according to employees. You may work for different companies but the rules be very different, that is the right of each board of directors to set those rules for their own company. I'll bet the other smaller sanctioning bodies of auto racing follow NASCAR's lead on this, why should NASCAR be a follower, they should be the leader.
I agree with Barry that eventually the science will likely back Mayfield into a corner. With the other tests that Mayfield claims to have, apparently an issue with the "B" sample that they have is that Mayfield and his attorney don't have any testing labs on their list where that sample can be tested where they do the specialized test that would differentiate between adderall/claritin and illegal meth. So it's quite possible that Mayfield and his attorney may have a bunch of test results but they may all be useless if complete and specific tests weren't done on the samples.
ReplyDeleteAs for the person suggesting that the media is only going along with NASCAR's agenda, the contrary has actually been true from the start of when this story has broke. Not only have media members been critical of NASCAR's drug policy and the way they administer that policy but they've also let Mayfield and his attorney have his say. In fact I think the media has done an excellent job of bending over backwards to report on the claims of both sides.
One more bit of anecdote: I once knew a guy that drove heavy equipment for a living. He beat his company's drug test for 5 years.
ReplyDeleteThat company used a lab that came by the worksite to take the sample. Word would always leak out when they were coming.
The day of the test, he would have his young child pee in a zip lock baggie, then tape the baggie to his inner thigh.
When called to give his test, he would simply pour the baggie contents into the specimen cup (they didn't use the direct observe procedure).
Like I said, worked like a charm for 5 years. Until one day he died on the job from a drug overdose.
If Jeremy's independent tests weren't direct observe, I wouldn't put any faith into them whatsoever.
In fact I think the media has done an excellent job of bending over backwards to report on the claims of both sides.
ReplyDeleteBut doing precious little investigating. It is easy to "report claims."
Checking into the validity of those claims is a lot tougher, but they ought to be doing it.
I'm now more intrigued about step mom shooting Jeremy's dad. That's a story I want to hear about.
ReplyDeleteIt's interesting to have this back and forth debate about Jeremy and NASCAR. A lot of good points have been brought up. Did he or didn't he? Did they or didn't they?
I know that if I could show negative drug tests I'd be dancing all over NASCARs front door showing them they're number one. But, maybe that's being saved for court.
Dot @ work.
@ Barry, oh the irony.
Mystery tests?
ReplyDeleteThey could contain mystery urine, so they have no bearing in this decision.
From ESPN...according to Chapel Hill N.C. medical examiner in 2007, Terry Mayfield died of self inflicted gun shot wound to the chest.
ReplyDeleteEverything about this story is undbelievably tragic.
PS...maybe the medical examiner lied, was inexperienced or was paid off to cover up his stepmother killing his father.
ReplyDeleteeaglesoars said...
ReplyDeleteWhy would you go to a completely different type of sport that are testing for totally different things and drugs and ask questions they probably want to know some answers on too? Aegis is a company that goes into sports and businesses looks at their needs and helps create the program needed. I don't see anything wrong with the system NASCAR has, and I would have no problems competing under their rules.
There's some pretty important things being overlooked here IMO. You can not compare NASCAR to any of the stick in ball sports, for one the same hazards do not apply, but far bigger issue than that would be the organizational set up of the 2. The charters that organize the other sporting activities are totally different be cause NASCAR comes under free enterprise. It is a privately owned and privately held corporation. NASCAR is not really a sport, it is a trade name the same as Wal-Mart, Sears, Shell, Mobile etc. is, they just happen to be in the business of organizing stock car bodied auto racing events, being the sanctioning body to write and enforce the rules to "THEIR" business. So the rules that apply to NASCAR would be the same rules that apply to privately owned corporations, and actually they would be considered a small corporation according to employees. You may work for different companies but the rules be very different, that is the right of each board of directors to set those rules for their own company. I'll bet the other smaller sanctioning bodies of auto racing follow NASCAR's lead on this, why should NASCAR be a follower, they should be the leader.
Why? Because NASCAR wants to be treated like every stick and ball sport, when they're not. Who says Aegis can't filter their information. When you write a paper for college, do you rely on one source with one point of view? Or do you get many sources and many points of view and then select what you need to complete the paper.
If I was Brian France, I would not only sit down with Aegis but sit down with the MLB, NFL, Olympics, WADA, Indy Car, to get many perspectives, how they go about at test, what do they test for, what drug lists to they have, what paper work needs to be filed for added prescriptions, how long does paper work take and the processing, what can a driver to do cover up drug use, what health conditions (Touretts, ADHD, Graves' etc) do you need to be on the watch for, how do you deal with them. Take plenty of notes. Then you sit back down with Dr. Black and tell him what you like and what you don't like about what you see with other sports testing. Talk about NASCAR's needs -health problems of some drivers, driving 200 mph, conditions in the car. Brian France goes into this meeting a little smarter and full of information. When you know zero about something, isn't it better just to over research something than under research something rather just trust the one source. BF doesn't need to take everyone's advice, just to tuck it in for future reference. I bet if he had done just that, he wouldn't be in this mess.
Every sport that does drug testing has these two things in common-weed out the cheaters and weed out ones that are a danger to themselves and others, and there's no reason why NASCAR can't have that in common with their drug testing.
But now that Brian France has gotten the Feds involved... I wonder how long it will be before they'll take over.
I digress, we won't agree on whether Brian France should have asked other sports about their drug testing policies. I just think, if you don't know about something, take a breath, and ask lots of questions of others who know more about the subject and get binders and binders of information for current and future reference. Rather than the knee jerk reaction Brian France and Company seem to do.
Evernham talking to Moody about Mayfield right now. Never had him take a drug test during his time driving for him. Only "erratic" behavior occurred during the end. Never saw any indication of drug use.
ReplyDeleteGreat discussion everyone.
ReplyDeleteI feel duped. Some years ago, my mom went out with a nice guy - turned out to be an alcoholic. I would endorse what a lot of others said, that the family don't want to see the signs, even if they are there. I feel duped because I believed JM about this. Heck, I believed JM about the Evernham/Crocker thing. Yep, totally duped. Just like with my mom's guy.
There is one test JM could have done that would convict or clear Aegis once and for all - sent his own sample, anonymously via a lawyer, to Aegis for testing himself. He knows what Nascar test for - he could get Aegis to test those for himself.
Of course, IMO, now JM is all about smoke and mirrors. The step-mom is a god-send. Another distraction, just like the conspiracy theory, just like "list", just like everything else.
Brian France is many things (most of them not good), but he isn't capable of organising a racing series - how is he meant to organise a conspiracy. Pur-lease.
I want Jeremy to leave now. I also want him to get help. He won't of course. They rarely do, unless it is to buy time or another obfuscation.
Media coverage. These things are always tricky, where law suits are involved. ESPN did the best of everyone. It does however bring into focus a set of reporters who, as a rule, tow the Nascar party line. The all-powerful Nascar that can ex-communicate you just for criticising them - that is never good. One of the reasons no-one believes Nascar is that no-one believes the reporters who don't question them. Maybe that used to work in the past. That time is not now.
And finally, OT...
@dot When I comment, I don't want anyone to think, "Oh, there's lame Dot, typing out of her rear."
Post of the year, because it was totally unexpected in the middle of a serious discussion. Don't worry honey. There are many people in the world who type out of their rear. You aren't one of them.
Mayfield claims he has been tested every 4 or so days. By HIS own labs of his choosing. He has never said NASCAR has tested him all those times. Which explains why he would say his results in those would come up negative.
ReplyDeleteThis is a perfect he said, she said scenario. He is painting NASCAR to be the big evil empire while trying to drum up sympathy for himself. He is a smart enough guy that if he has had a problem as long as it is claimed, to hide it very well, so he is probably going to hit NASCAR where it hurts. People remember the Tim Richmond situation so he can convince people to be skeptical of the sanctioning body as the evil wicked empire. Look at Dot and others on here who up until yesterday were convinced JM was innocent.
NASCAR obviously in this case is going to paint JM to be a lowlife drug addict.
What is the truth? JM or NASCAR? Or perhaps somewhere in the middle? Thats what the courts are going to have to decide unfortunately. JM's comments and actions up to date though honestly have reminded me of a drug addict. Ive had a brother who used meth and Ive seen the effects. He fit the "typical" news profile but as others on here have also said, they've seen professional type people use and not look like the stereotype.
NASCAR has their lab that they trust. They aren't some rinky-dink nothing lab regardless how JM may feel about it.
Everyone agrees the NASCAR policy needs some adjustments. Many have already been made as a result of this whole situation beginning to start with. I don't think we're going to have any winners when this is all said and done. Just alot of hurt feelings, but hopefully a better, stronger, cleaner sport and substance abuse policy when its all over.
david said...Everyone agrees the NASCAR policy needs some adjustments. Many have already been made as a result of this whole situation beginning to start with. I don't think we're going to have any winners when this is all said and done. Just alot of hurt feelings, but hopefully a better, stronger, cleaner sport and substance abuse policy when its all over.
ReplyDeleteRight on. That is the only thing good that has come out of this. It forces NASCAR to examine their drug policies and perhaps some common sense will come into the policy!
To his credit, JM was right about the Evernham/Crocker thing. The mistake was being an employee of Evernham and running his mouth.
ReplyDeletePenske, fired Mayfield for some reason.
Evernham, fired Mayfield.
Haas, fired Mayfield
Pattern?
Jim Rome is running with this story, its really getting weirder and weirder.
Hopefully ESPN has a former teammate like Rusty on, even though they had a poor relationship, I'm very curious what he has to say if anything on this...
If Mayfield has unstable parents (if father allegedly committed suicide) that points to mental health issues which would explain trying to fix himself with meth.
ReplyDeleteBUT it can also mean he is a pathological liar or narcissistic personality disorder. All which he fits. NPD ALWAYS feels victimized, it's never them it's EVERYBODY ELSE thus the hostile attitude that never seems to go away.
NN comes out swinging with the highlights of past shows after some sound bites from Sirius show
But the denials at this point are embarrassing for JM and his friends and loved ones.
Also why didn't the step mom SPEAK UP. Racing is dangerous.
I HATE to keep bringing up Pete Rose but he had convicted felons and others saying PETE bet on baseball. Well their stories seemed coherent. Took 18 years before Rose admitted to it. JM seems to have the same mental disorder of being UNABLE to see reality.
When did Ramsey Poston take over this blog? If I didn't know better I'd swear NASCAR's official mouthpiece had written this entry. What happened to innocent until proven guilty? BTW, this is written by someone who has no use for Jeremy as a driver.
ReplyDeleteSophia says...
ReplyDeleteAlso why didn't the step mom SPEAK UP. Racing is dangerous.
Exactly! This is where NASCAR's lawyers failed. They should have brought her in as a witness before Judge Mullen. The injunction wouldn't have been granted. It makes them look stupid and now it looks like NASCAR coerced her to come out or she has a vendetta...
Also, Judge Mullen should have ordered what lab Mayfield and NASCAR should submit their samples (hair and urine as urine only tells someone they used, hair determines how long) to an independent lab rather than Aegis.
Frankly, at this point, I don't believe anybody. (NASCAR and Dr. Black have this I am god complex going for them.) And frankly, I think the fans could write up a better drug policy than what NASCAR has done!
Up to this point-Jeremy's guilty of a big mouth and nothing else (Evernham and Penske are witnesses to that), because we don't know all the facts and are filtered some of them. Lay out every single document both sides have, his medical records, and dental records and let the public decide. Believe it or not, we're smarter than we look. ;)
What happened to innocent until proven guilty?
ReplyDeleteI keep hearing this. How many times do you have to proven guilty before you believe it?
He failed his first test. Guilty. He failed a B-sample test and a second lab. Guilty. He failed this second test. Guilty.
Evidence he is innocent? None. Negative tests entered by Mayfield's attorney's to the court as evidence: None.
He's guilty already.
I really feel sorry for Jeremy and Shana Mayfield. I feel Nascar is grasping at straws on this for some reason. Why would jayski post on their website that he tested positive again which I believe is false then they get his step-mother to sign a document. Wow Nascar is really looking foolish finding his step-mother to sign an affadavit. Did everyone see Ray Evernham's statement?
ReplyDeleteThis is where NASCAR's lawyers failed. They should have brought her in as a witness before Judge Mullen.
ReplyDeleteSounds like someone doesn't understand federal procedure.
She signed an affidavit, which is her sworn testimony under penalty of perjury, and that was submitted to the court. So she DID serve as a witness to the judge. You don't have to be there in person, and her chance to testify on the stand won't come for months (if this goes that far). Stop basing your legal analysis on how they do things on TV shows.
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ReplyDeleteWhat happened to innocent until proven guilty?
ReplyDeleteThis is a civil case, not a criminal case. Mayfield is the plaintiff and must prove his case.
I just wanted to say that this is a pretty high minded debate! I want to thank you all for being very civil.
ReplyDeleteI have not seen where anyone in the media has asked NASCAR how they came up with its drug testing program and who was involved. I have seen where B France recently commented in talking to the press that NASCAR considered the policies of other sports, but apparently no one in the media thought or cared to ask him to explain in detail how the program was developed and who was involved. In other words, the media has not seemed to be interested in reporting what resources and experts, if any, were involved in crafting the NASCAR program. If the NASCAR program is so clearly flawed, where was the media last fall to point such out to the public. To the extent there are serious flaws with the NASCAR program, the media deserves some of the blame for failing to point them out last fall - but that would have required real analysis.
ReplyDeleteI have had no personal experience with drug testing programs and the media has provided scant real information to use to evaluate NASCAR's program. Except for 1 article by David Newton making a limited comparison to the NFL, I have seen no one compare NASCAR'S program to that of another major racing series or sport - which I still find odd and disappointing, especially since any ESPN writer could walk down the hall or pick up the phone and talk to other ESPN reporters that should be quite familiar with the programs of MLB, the NFL, or the NBA.
If I exclude Ryan McGee and David Newton, and am generous, overall I would give the media at best a C- for its coverage of Mayfield and the NASCAR drug testing program.
I do find it curious that Mayfield said in his state court filing that he has had to sell personal belongings to pay expenses, but yesterday indicated that he has the resources or backing to fight NASCAR as long as needed to clear his name.
I do find this topic very intersting, although it does give me tired head. Looking at Aegis' web site, part of they they do is design/implement testing programs. I can see now why NASCAR wouldn't provide a list, as these guys can check for anything or everything. They also say that they can check for a prescribed drug, and tell if it's been taken according to the prescription. In looking thru what they can test for, it seemed all of their tests were either urine, blood/serum or both. No mention of hair anywhere.
ReplyDeleteNot that it matters, I suppose. And yes, I do have too much free time.
I want to know what the others who have been suspended by NASCAR for doing drugs (allegedly) think. They lost their livelihoods too. Are they in some kind of program? Did they just slink off into the sunset? Why hasn't someone interviewed them, even if anonymously?
ReplyDeleteWill this set a precedent for them? If they could prove wrong doing by Aegis, wouldn't they jump on the JM legal bandwagon, too?
Re: Stepmom witnessing Jeremy's drug use. It sounds like she was participating. Never back in my party days would I, nor my friends, do anything in front of parents, or the like. How would she just happen to "catch" him 30 times? Something's not right there.
Hard to know what's going on here. Where it's easy to just look at the situation and say that the incredibly nonsensical, irrational way it's unfolded is the result of a severely troubled addict acting as addicts do, that's kind of an over-generalization.
ReplyDelete1) If Mayfields initial defense was correct, that the testing process was inadequate, what would have stopped the second test from being just as wrong as the first?
2) If I understand it right, a few hours bought is not going to allow Mayfield to drink enough water to not piss a positive meth sample.
3) The original contention that false positive showed such high concentrations that a functional person couldn't have tested as such is correct. Just saying Mayfield was an addict, after all, then, is not necessarily accurate, because if Mayfield was such an addict, his previous behavior, let alone physical appearance, still doesn't support this. He's got his teeth. He doesn't shake. He's not particularly skinny.
4) The affiant, his step mom, is not as damming to me as anyone else thinks. You would be amazed the animosity that can be taken advantage of in situations like this. Truth tends to be strange than fiction, I know as a lawyer that has dealt in people's muck all my life. It's not at all unheard of, hard as it is to believe, that Mayfield's step mom could fabricate this out of ulterior motives. I truly believe it's possible, though other evidence damns Mayfield anyway.
5) Jeremy needs help if he truly is an addict.
6) Again, truth is stranger than fiction. I have witnesses several imbroglios of this nature, though obviously ones occurring on a less public stage. When you have such a bevy of confusing things going on, typically the answer is not as cut and dry as anyone could imagine.
7) the fact that mayfield would continue to fight this although his career is already ruined is not consistent with him being an addict.
8) in the end, Mayfield shouldn't be cursing at every journalist he can, and should be saying "I will take a test every day, at a different lab every day, to show im not a meth head." the fact he didnt do this - although he shouldnt have to - because he has so much to gain by clearing himself, does smack of the fact he is an addict.
In the end he is prolly an addict but let's not pillory him. Best of luck to him and his family to getting his shiz together and his health back in order if need be.
9) Karma is a bizzo. Never like Mayfield when he played a low blow and pretended is was relevant that Evernham was doing Crocker when he sued about getting fired. Not very cool. So I guess we know he's not above using lawyers to all their nasty extremes.
10) Jeremy is prolly an addict. Sad.
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ReplyDeletejone1981, as a lawyer yourself, would you please explain to us the difference in the guilt in a criminal case being "guilty beyond a reasonable doubt" and a civil case "the greater weight of the evidence?"
ReplyDeleteThanks.
@ Slater 7:57pm
ReplyDeleteI read in an article that Dr. Black doesn't believe that hair analysis is accurate and that there is a shampoo that washes away all traces of drugs.
Disclaimer 1: with the hundreds of articles, I don't have time to point you to the correct one
Disclaimer 2: not having any personal experience with drugs or drug testing, I have no idea if there is a shampoo or not
The things that his step-mother had posted on her blog prior to her affidavit signing clearly show that she had some kind of axe to grind with him. Gotta wonder if you could really take her word for it.
ReplyDeleteanon - A shampoo cannot 'wash away the drugs'. The evidence is contained within the overall make up of the hair itself and is not something that can be merely washed away.
ReplyDeleteOkay, I waded through all the comments, so have a pretty good idea of where everyone stands. Now I'll wait for the Judge. It's in his hands, not ours.
ReplyDeleteThanks for giving us the opportunity to express ourselves, JD.
SrRaceFan
@ Phathead
ReplyDeleteI thought it sounded strange when I read that Dr. Black said that, but I had to assume that he knows more than I do.
Thanks for clearing that up!
Hair tests are not reliable beyond showing a positive for certain things.
ReplyDeleteHair tests cannot make distinctions, only provide residue of certain substances.
If you take a drug on Monday, it won't be until almost the next Monday when hair carrying evidence of drug use will begin growing.
Since the new drug-laced hair grows from the base, getting a sample that does not include "neutral hair" is not always easy.
Hair tests are the easiest to defeat using any number of shampoos. You can also bleach your hair and no trace will be found (it's bleach, after all).
For a simple, inexpensive work-place test, a hair test can easily spot a chronic user. But it cannot catch a recent user, cannot be considered 100% accurate, cannot draw distinctions between other agents that might generate a false positive (unlike the Aegis test which eliminates false positives by isolating elements in the urine), and is not considered reliable at all for this type of application.
Any and all mention of hair tests -- as if there is some other more accurate test that has not been performed but will alone clear Mayfield - are distractions. They are not relevant to this case.