It was a beautiful night in Richmond, VA. However, the weather did not help the racing or the television coverage on FOX.
Chris Myers presented a pre-race show that was more notable for what it omitted than what it contained.
No story on the disabled veteran Heath Calhoun, pictured above with winner Kyle Busch, who was selected to have the race named in his honor by Crown Royal. ESPN profiled Calhoun on the morning edition of NASCAR Now and then aired another feature on him repeatedly on SportsCenter and ESPNEWS.
Slice of Pizzi was also missing this week. Instead, Darrell Waltrip and Jeff Hammond filled the time with a scripted agenda that focused on stories like the friction between two of the Hendrick Motorsports drivers.
Philadelphia, a major TV market, was another story early on in the telecast. The local FOX TV station in Philly chose to air a political debate from 7 to 8PM ET. The station never provided a graphic that informed NASCAR fans what was happening. At 8PM, viewers joined the NASCAR telecast. Unfortunately, the NASCAR on FOX team never welcomed the Philly fans or provided a highlights package of the first thirty laps which had been missed.
Once underway, Mike Joy began to call the action with Waltrip and Larry McReynolds. Joy has been quite different this season on the air. Perhaps, the lower profile of Joy has been caused by the extended conversations between Waltrip and McReynolds.
The start of the race saw FOX use a wide variety of cameras and show a wide variety of cars. Things looked to be rather disjointed, but it became clear this was the director's pattern for this race. Eventually, things settled down but it was an interesting first half of the race for fans.
The short track action did not translate well to the small screen for whatever reason. Talladega memories perhaps were still in the minds of many. It began to be a grind and fans showed up online to object to how the race was being covered. It was not a pleasant experience for many.
FOX has three more Sprint Cup Series races remaining in 2010. What we would like from you is an honest opinion on the TV coverage of the Richmond race. Just click the comments button below to add your comments. It's important to get the opinion of the fans immediately after the race.
As always, this is a family-friendly website. Please keep that in mind when posting. Thank you for taking the time to add your comments.
Fox needs to take a step back and broadcast the show on the track instead of trying to make themselves the show.
ReplyDeleteDo they ever watch their own DVD's of the race on Tuesday? Watch this one and tell me you could follow it!
ReplyDeleteNever a word about Kahne's driver's suit I think and how it might have affected his drive tonight.
Really FOX had a difficult night. Again ESPN wins the duel.
Just a heads-up that FOX once again moved over to SPEED and offered a live post-race that cut into a show on SPEED.
ReplyDeleteNo promotion of this at all during the race. None before it happened.
It is a shame that DW is so much in love with Kyle Busch. I thought TV reporters need to be unbiased....but with DW and Kyle Busch it seems that no one else is racing but Kyle. I thought there are 42 other drivers who have fans , fans who would like to hear about their driver. DW needs to learn this...not all fans like Kyle Busch so DW stop pushing him down our throats
ReplyDeleteHis closing comments were amazing on that topic.
ReplyDeleteI don't think FOX did a bad job at all. Those who complain about the broadcast can turn it off and leave it for the diehard fans who appreciate being able to watch the race.
ReplyDeleteIf you could help us out with some of the TV elements that you liked, your comment might make some more sense in this TV forum.
ReplyDeleteBased off of the review on the home page : The pre race show was good, what more could they have done in 30 minutes. They covered they major story lines from last week, the great Talladega race and 24 vs 48, and they previewed this race. Then there was no reason to catch up the fans in Philly, it would have disrupted the coverage and not be needed for 99% of the other people watching. The commentators were entertaining throughout the race and of the 3 networks, I find them to be the best. Finally, FOX showed the few cars that were the best the entire race and there was no need to talk much about the other cars that kept getting lap. That is why I said my statement before that FOX did a good job.
ReplyDeleteDidn't DW say before the final restart that he thought Jeff had Kyle beat? Then when Kyle takes the lead and the win and they go to the booth for final thoughts, DW jumps on the KB bandwagon saying he knew he'd come through? Quite annoying...
ReplyDeleteIf ESPN puts together Cup broadcasts like they are for the Nationwide Series, they may surpass FOX in terms of quality of coverage. Hearing Allen in the booth Friday night was great to hear, although I am a Marty Reid fan as well.
I will say I did not enjoy this broadcast at all from Fox! Dont know why it didnt do it for me. To much focus on the leader! Heck the last restart DW said there has to be another wreck how there running 4 wide back there, then Larry Mac goes MAYBE 5 WIDE!!! And what do we get no shot of that just a single car image of K Busch?? Ah well no ones perfect but Fox have to say this broadcast wasnt up to par in my book. Plus only 1 crank it up??? I have wanted, got, and always enjoy my fix of 2 crank it ups on FOX since 2004 when I started watching and was a little mad when they didnt do a 2nd.... maybe I missed it but dont think I did. Wish Gordon would of won I feel for him must suck cause it never seems to fall in his lap at the end
ReplyDeleteExcept you didn't say any of that. Thanks for the follow-up, that is why I asked.
ReplyDeleteIt was nice to see bonus post-race coverage on Speed again. They did a better job with it than last week when one interview was repeated. This week, we saw most of the top ten interviewed (including the entire top five) and another rundown of the points plus a recap of the final run to the checkered flag. This kind of reminds me of NBC back when they used CNBC for bonus coverage when they went over their broadcast window. I like it.
ReplyDeleteThere is a reason that Jabber Jaws
ReplyDeletewears that Toyota label on his
Trackside shirt and Hambone the
Discount Tire. If Fox/Speed had
any concern about the integrity of
their presentations they would not
allow their announcers to be
shills. But then again, they, as
well as NA$CAR probably get a cut.
The broadcast last night was the
worst I have seen since the
Talledega single file.
Again, I did not care for the coverage of the race. And again, the reasons were: 1) the A.D.D. camera work; 2) the OVERUSE of in-close, in-car, bumper, camera work instead of "pulled back", wide camera shots; and 3) the "over the top" commentary by DW and LM.
ReplyDeleteNone of these would be hard to correct, but you would have to be willing to listen. Criticism can be done out of love and not just out of hate.
My routine on race day anymore is to catch Raceday on Speed, skip the prerace on Fox, when the race comes on mute the TV and stream MRN/PRN on the computer, much more enjoyable that way.
ReplyDeleteUnlike the past three Cup races, I saw no improvement at all this week. Again we were "treated" to a very poor mixture of camera shots giving neither the experienced racing viewers or the NASCAR newbies in my home Saturday night a full sense of what was happening during the race. Mike Joy was still just acting as a third commentator rather than as a play-by-play man. As a comparison, the very boring competition-wise IndyCar race at Kansas was made much more exciting and watchable by the ABC/ESPN crew (even though Scott Goodyear is always about as flat as a three-day old open soda pop unless Eddie Cheever is there to poke him enough) while the Fox crew took a track where hard racing is going on most of the time and made it very ho-hum.
ReplyDeleteThe most striking incident last night of the complete disconnect that has occurred at Fox was during a pass (I forget now between which cars) when they were using the bumper cam on a car in the upper lane to look down on the car attempting to get by below. The car in the lower lane got by but, instead of switching to an upper view or another battle, Fox remained stuck on that camera and there was nothing on the screen but an empty track for what seemed like forever. There were many similarly bad incidents but that one really took the cake.
As for DW...his timing and subject matter is completely out of whack. Without any prompting from me (other than to have to apologize once again for "Boogity, boogity, boogity"), the people joining me in my home during the race that are not NASCAR fans could not figure out how what he was saying was supposed to add to their understanding of what was going on.
Again I want to say that no sports telecast is perfect. You folks that have never been in a TV booth cannot imagine how nutty it is (and I only did it for a short time on an amateur basis, nothing even beginning to approach Mr. Daly's vast experience). Our complaints here are not about the occasional blown camera shot or inevitable verbal flub. Those of us that have followed and loved NASCAR for any good length of time whether it is those who came in during the late 1990's or later to those that started in the 1970's or earlier like me can plainly see that what Fox is doing this year in almost every respect is turning off fans and potential fans of all stripes.
Awful.
ReplyDeleteAny race fan will say the very same thing because Fox refused to establish any kind of flow or provide context for what the cameras were showing.
They must have a bingo caller in charge of switching cameras, surely no one with any broadcast experience could do that bad of a job.
It would also be nice to get some information from the pit reporters during green flag racing. Heck they're paying them anyway, might as well use them.
I can't imagine how bad morale must be behind the scenes with a veteran crew that knows they are producing broadcasts that rival the final year of Cup on NBC.
p.s. thanks to the Fox pr folks for the comic relief
Too many tight cameras. Should have used shots from the top of the porch like ESPN did. And also the stupid little animation about what the term "tight" means shows us how much FOX focuses on catering to the LCD. Even F1 fans would know tight from loose, even though understeer is more often used in their lexicon.
ReplyDeleteOnly four points races, plus the All-Star, until TNT takes FOX to school. Six races after that, with some hope, ESPN will really take them to preschool.
And they forget that many of us use Trackpass so we can see what's actually happening. Last night T/P was about 8 seconds ahead, so 'real time'. The number of times they'll give a phony stat (lap speed, time vs leader, etc.) I'll look at the REAL data and just go nuts! How can a driver be closing the gap when he's actually losing .5 secs/lap! Too many other expamples to mention.
ReplyDeleteYeah DW has his own agenda during these cup races, whether it's selling Digger merchandise or yakking about his favorites which happen to be KB or Jr. Anyway, I was on twitter and blog and missed a lot of the live race.
ReplyDeleteI watched the FOX pre-race, hoping for a profile of Heath Calhoun because I'd missed earlier shows. No such luck.
ReplyDeleteI got the hyped "feud" between Gordon/Johnson. However, to my delight Pizzi wasn't around. A gold star for that.
Immediately after the race started, the ADHD camera work began. The constant jumping from one to another made me nauseous and wish I had a seasick pill. There was no rhyme or reason to the camera selection. I don't want to see the side of a car, I want to see where that car is running and who he's racing.
Frequently the booth would talk about 3 or 4 wide racing. Where?
Believe me, had my small radio station carried the race, I would have been listening -- NOT watching. Streaming on the computer isn't an option, either. What I did finally do was just turn the sound down on the TV and follow the leaderboard on the computer --- that made about as much sense as what I was being given by the broadcast.
As fans, we shouldn't have to resort to outside information to follow a race. I remember when the pictures and commentators painted the picture for us. In the past, you could listen to the TV, close your eyes and "see" what was happening. Not any more..
Talladega last week was a postive delight. I was so ready for Richmond. What a downer....
How can they be talking about one driver in the pits, and be showing another? Then go back to the one that they WERE talking about, and totally miss another one?
ReplyDeleteThe long shots, if they'd just left the camera there, would have told the race. I don't need to floor cam, the in-car cam looking out the side, the bumper cam. Just let me see the field.
And DW, please, just give it up.
And that thing about "tight"? I learned about "tight" when I started watching Nascar in 1984. I don't think the meaning has changed, and I don't think there are any new fans you need to explain it to.
And, oh yes, I turned off the pre-race after they started going on about the 24-48 "feud" which became a non-issue on Tuesday.
I can't listen to MRN, although I'd love to, because I'm listening to the scanner. Oh, but I wish I could.
Camera work was ok but the camera choice from the truck was very poor. Overhead blimp shots are great from this short track but were used sparingly. In car shots are useless except in wrecks and were used to excess. PxP was almost non-existent. I listened to radio and enjoyed it very much. Fox sports seems to have run off the tracks.
ReplyDeleteOh,and how many of you flipped when Jeff Burton was leading and FOX went to the obligatory shot of Kim Burton in her "hoping Jeff wins" mode?
ReplyDeleteI was so glad he didn't win, so we didn't have to see her crying instead of the cars crossing the finish line.
Funny (or not so much) part about the Philly deal is the debate was on 2 other networks also. However watched it on PitCommand and listened to the scanner All we missed was the blathering on Fox. Still Fox did a poor job with that deal for the Philly area viewers.
ReplyDeleteLast night was literally a hot mess.
ReplyDeleteWhile talking about glowing brakes we got to see the side of the 48. The door not the brakes. Who knows if his brakes were glowing? Couldn't see it.
Couldn't see pass for the lead under green - we got it in replay.
In fact most of the first 2/3 of the race we saw re -plays of ( pick something interesting) - and a where did he come from...
Add that to local problems here with Brighthouse cable & TECO power, it was awful. When we got back from whatever outage we had just endured - there was no way to figure out what was going on. No PxP, and every in car bumper cam caused the top ticker to stop & then re start at the beginning. Frustrating to say the least.
It was so bad I turned the TV off with 94 to go & "watched" on Pit Command & listened to MRN ( who were having umm issues at some points) It was better than the junk Fox was putting on.
If I had never been to a race & only saw this "coverage" I would not spend my hard earned $$ to go see it in person. Might be explaining some of the empty seats.
Or maybe its D.Hills way off getting us to the track? Cue the black helicopter folks.
anon 11:53--I couldn't disagree more with the idea that it's only their job to cover the leaders. Their job is to cover the entire race. If a car is getting lapped, we should hear about why that car isn't faster, handling problems, etc. This is something MRN manages to do every week, and why I gave up on Fox to turn the radio on, therefore, I can't say much else about Fox coverage.
ReplyDeleteWas there a HD broadcast problem? My HD pic kept breaking up (only that channel) but the reg. picture was not doing it. Maybe it was my cable co.
ReplyDeleteIt seems that Waltrip and Larry are having these conversations between themselves instead of telling it to the TV audience. I keep wondering if I'm in a bar with them or etc. Two "booth monkeys" would be far and away enough, and maybe they could keep from stepping all over one another.
I always look forward to the short track races, and Richmond is one of the best. Last night, I had no clue as to what was actually taking place on the track. The in car cams and isolated shots of one car running alone gave no insight as to how the race was developing. No full field rundowns, no explanations of why so many cars had gone laps down so early...it was a mess. It made me realize why my interest in Nascar has been waning the past couple years. If I can't watch on TV and get caught up in the excitement, there's not much point in watching. Nascar can blame the economy as much as they want, but if what fans were seeing on TV were compelling enough, lots of fans would be making the decision to spend their discretionary income attending a race. Instead, many of us are tuning out completely.
ReplyDeleteI could not follow what was going on whatsoever. Confused broadcast, confusing the fans. Sure I can read that tracker at the top and miss the action that should be on tv. But they never explained What was going on to make those movements happen. I can not wait for TNT. And if ESPN can pull off with Cup what they showed me with Nationwide Friday then the rest of the season should be a good one as soon as Fox is done. I have full confidence in TNT. Fox should be financially penalized for airing such a shoddy product. Nascar has their product fixed for the most part. And Fox is taking it down.
ReplyDeletePre-race:
ReplyDeleteNN - most of it very good. Thank you for piece on Heath Calhoun. One hour, good.
RD - Haven't watched in some time. Two hours, too long, and at times, too silly. I'm all for fun, but some of it is buffoonery.
Pre-race - 30 minutes, perfect! Limited junk. Piece on Heath would have been most appropriate.
Race:
Is it just me or is Larry Mac audtioning for PxP? He will be commenting on something, then stop mid sentence and do pxp. Very annoying.
Whoever said previously: "stream of consciousness" hit the nail on the head. Totally annoying.
The camera work is atrocious. Same ol, same ol; single cars, in-cams, no racing in the back of the pack. Sometimes have to close my eyes as the "jumping bean" cameras start to bother my eyes.
Hammond or anyone full screen giving info that could be presented 1) during caution or 2)on prerace or 3) in a small box with racing in large!! The pit box segments are a total waste. I would be interested in a piece with a current crew chief explaining how they use all those tools during a race...in a prerace segment!
Total lack of explaining what is happening to comers and goers. I will use JR as example, but would like this info on any of the drivers. He came from 25 to 13th, before 1st pit stop. They did mention something about taking wrong swing as well as some other drivers. But how about a little more info on what that might have been. And definitely, why did they not take the wave around? Since all but a few did it,that would have been info worth knowing about all who decided to pit.
I would forgive them on the above if they were truly giving useful information during the entire race. Maybe they can't fit everything in. But most of it is blather. Oh, that's it! Blather more important than race info. Silly me.
Finally, I am seriously considering just listening to radio live and foregoing the race on TV. I can do some other things around the house and most important, not get so aggravated.
Don't know what happened to FOX, used to love them.
Oh...maybe they are doing what I accused ESPN of doing a year or 2 ago. Maybe they are trying to get out of their contract. But since NASCAR doesn't seem to notice, probably not!
West Coast Diane. I know what your talking about with Jr. As an avid Stewart fan I have zero clue as to what happened to him. Drove to about 10th, then next thing I saw on the ticker he was a lap down and in 20th something. They never said a word. And as Jr, Steward is a top tier driver. Just simply sad coverage.
ReplyDeleteWow.
ReplyDeleteThis sounded like another mess as usual.
To me the broadcast was HORRIBLE.
ReplyDeleteFirst of all the ridiculous camera shots are hideous. Let me explain it once again... wide angle shots allow the fans to actually see and anticipate what is happening.
Continual bumper cams and speed shots show us nothing. Can anyone please answer why they insist on constantly showing these especially after restarts?
On top of that a perfect example of the horrible directing was when Kyle Busch was trying to lap Jimmie Johnson. Clearly they were racing hard and Busch even gave him a nice tap. Right after that FOX cuts away to something else. Why???
And how about the replay we got of Dale Jr. thinking about making it 3-wide. Seriously? So glad I got to see that.
And finally as mentioned earlier is anyone else sick of DW, LArry Mac, and Mike Joy talking about the great things going on around the track while we are watching something else???
Honestly... I just do not understand why the race coverage was so much superior years (actually decades) ago as compared to today.
Every aspect of last night's broadcast was amateurish is every imaginable way. NASCARonFOCKS has worsened each and every year they have been on the air since 2001. The producer cannot grasp what a race is, cannot transform the action on the track into a cohesive video stream and will not make the effort to learn to do so. The director has been out to lunch for years and no one at NASCARonFOCKS knows or cares. The haphazard manner in which the camera cuts are made are the most buffoonish part of the broadcast and the camera shots selected for the video stream indicate total apathy from the allegedly professional broadcasters that NASCARonFOCKS claim they are. Meet The Focksters. They hate us. They despise us. Watch the broadcast-there's your evidence.
ReplyDeleteJust want to show FOX that you actually are allowed to broadcast a race with nice wide camera shots!
ReplyDeletehttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aP0OIDFaQI4&feature=related
Michael...what a great example! Just within the first 90 seconds, notice the wider camera angles giving the viewer an appropriate perspective of the action, the crisp and timely cuts by the director, the immediate presentation of the information that the #17 and #33 were racing for position and exactly what those positions were, and how the color commentator was not "stomping" all over the play-by-play man or gushing like a little schoolgirl over either of the drivers battling for the lead.
ReplyDeleteAlso...how appropriate for this blog that the clip opens with Darrell Waltrip going yet another lap down. >:-)
That clip goes on beyond that opening 90 seconds to show even more examples of how a sports television broadcast should be done (not to mention some great old memories of cars and drivers of the past and not just the great battle between Earnhardt and Elliott).
Mr. Daly, were you a part of this telecast? If so, this is the type of presentation of which a person can be proud!
Michael said...
ReplyDelete"Continual bumper cams and speed shots show us nothing. Can anyone please answer why they insist on constantly showing these especially after restarts?"
I've been wondering the same thing Michael. My theory. Sponsor shots. In-race commercials. There was one shot last night during the Cup race that closed in completly on the logo on the hood of a car. Completely. It was pittiful. Accident, maybe. But with there constant zooming in on one car, clearly showing the sponsor I'm not so shure anymore.
In car cams. Same thing. All they do is plug sponsors. I see myself turning a steering wheel every day. Whoopie. We ALL do that. I don't need to see it on TV.
I applauded ESPN's Nationwide race, and still do. But, at the begining of the race they interviewed Harvick with an in car cam at the start of the race. View looked to be from below his steering wheel looking up at him. I counted. Six decals total in the frame for his sponsor. Six, I counted them.
Anyway, for what it's worth, my opinion of the tight shots/bumper cams is all about airing commercials/sponsor plugs during the actual race - When NOT on commercial break. It's breaking the sport.
You all are wrong, the camera work is not disjointed or lousy, you simple have a different view of what you would like to see.
ReplyDeleteHalf way into the race it hit me on the head, they have most of the camera shots pre-planned. They have there lit of paying sponsors and how how much time airtime each is supposed to receive during the race. I suspect they are not even calling just camera numbers behind the scenes, it is more like, sponsor x on camera 2 for 3 seconds, next sponsor x on camera 5 for 5 seconds. Camera calling is simple done by what sponsors are supposed to get the airtime.
VERY SAD I MIGHT ADD!!!!
Oh, and DW, SHUT THE HELL UP!!!!! We are so sick of you and your ever changing views on everything. JG will win!!! Ohh I knew KB would pull it off. Lets not forget phoenix's "This is now a 4 tire race track" prediction.....all we can say is wrong again with a butt cover to follow. Go sit on your rocking chair alone, it is where you belong!
LOL about the camera work, even DW and crew were commenting on how the shot was making the dizzy! I felt then that the guy in the truck was purposly going to the bumper cams and digger shots cause after the comment from DW it got much worse~~~~~~~~~!!!!!!!!!!!!!
ReplyDeleteI agree the in car and tight shots make the race visually hard to follow. Larry Mac also needs to learn his role, it's something with older crew chiefs I guess because Andy still tries to do play by play on ESPN.
ReplyDeleteMike Joy's play by play is fine when he's not being talked over. I still don't get the criticism that there is no play by play from the guy.
I was one of those fans in the Philly market who tuned in and didn't know what was going on since the debate was on, not the pre-race. thanks to the folks on the Daly Planet blog who let me know the status.
ReplyDeleteSo this race broadcast got off to a bad start for me -- no green flag, no info from the Fox booth, and no early recap of the race so I'd get caught up. The thing is that it didn't get much better when I could actually SEE the race on TV.
Fox has totally lost their minds when it comes to broadcasting a race.
The constantly changing camera shots made me dizzy and at one point the change was so quick that even sitting on my couchI thought I was going to be sick to my stomach.
Lots and lots of in car camera and DW and Larry waxing poetic about nothing. Certainly not anything that was action on the track. Then Fox decided to give us a full screen shots of Hammond, not once but twice during the broadcast. The race was under green flag conditions, not in caution. I tuned in to see the race, not a infomessage about brakes or whatever we were being shown when he was inside the truck with all the monitors. FOX, I don't CARE about all that trash. I want to see the race.
Thank goodness for twitter - since those of use who use that were actually getting information related to the race, but was never discussed in the broadcast.
Please let Mike Joy do the PXP and make DW and Larry shut up!
I watched the Nationwide race on Friday night and it was much more fun to watch. Allen B is absolutely great at PXP and even though Rusty is like DW and talks too much about nothing, Allen was able to contain it and tell us about the race.
June 6 is a month away and TNT will take over. I can't wait for Fox's "turn" to be over.
So, what's the difference here, everyone? Fox used to be the one and only network I truly enjoyed watching when it came to Nascar. I used to hate it when they stopped broadcasting and the races went over to TNT and then ESPN. So, what went so very wrong? Is it David Hill? Have the huge egos taken over in terms of DW and the rest? Are they relying too much on their silly technology to the detriment of showing the actual race? Have they changed directors and producers in the past two seasons? Is Nascar somehow in control of what they show on TV?
ReplyDeleteI think we all know the reasons why they have the incessant commercials-----someone has to pay for Brian France's boondoggle. And while I might be able to handle the increased commercials (even though they do seem to put them in the worst places), I simply cannot handle incompetence in terms of something that used to be pretty good. So, we need to figure out who's screwing the pooch, so to speak.
I need to ask you all this. I just watched my first Trackside for this season and I'm wondering, is John Roberts ill, or has he just stopped coloring his hair? I was flabbergasted to see his very gray hair, and I was hoping he isn't ill.
Brendan...before I begin, I don't mean any offense and realize that we just might be seeing things differently.
ReplyDeleteWhat I expect and what I feel a broadcast needs is indeed a man that sticks mostly to the play-by-play, blow-by-blow details of the action. This is the person that always fills in the "structural" details...for example (greatly simplifying), "Smith goes around Jones and puts himself into fifth place" -- a good thing to do as the ticker may be way off at the time the pass is made or those two might not have been on screen for a while and the viewer would have no idea how that pass fits in within the overall race.
Instead, all too often with what I feel is a very undisciplined booth, Joy is adding "color" by saying something like (again simplifying), "Smith's crew made a great call to take four tires and that's why he just passed Jones who only took two," something that the color commentators get paid to do.
Sure, it's not by any means bad when a play-by-play man adds "color" especially in the case of Joy who is probably respected by 100% of all Planeteers for his incredible racing and overall automotive knowledge. However, this "wandering" in the booth leads exactly to your observation about Joy being talked over so much (of course, aggravated by DW).
In any endeavor, but especially in broadcasting, a team needs defined roles. Otherwise, some things get done twice, others not at all, and the customers do not receive a good product or service.
With no defined roles (thus some saying they notice Larry McReynolds often doing more actual play-by-play than Joy), nobody either knows or remembers where they should stop or what they should really be talking about to fill the fans in and help them interpret what they are seeing.
Brendan, I encourage you to watch that YouTube clip Michael posted above and then search out a few more of a similar length with Bob Jenkins, Eli Gold, or Ken Squier...even some old IndyCar clips with part-timers like Jim McKay and Keith Jackson at the helm. Notice how they fill in the action and then set up for the color commentator(s) almost like a good straight man for a great comedy team. Shoot, go back a few seasons and watch an extended clip of Mike Joy's work at Fox and then compare it to what you are getting today. You still might not fully agree with those of us that claim Joy is no longer really doing play-by-play, but you might at least see the difference and understand how we can feel that way.
And, if you still disagree, that's OK. Both racing and The Daly Planet would be boring if we all agreed on everything. ;-) I should add that I do agree with you that it would be wrong to say that Mike Joy is doing no real play-by-play. We just differ on the amount and we certainly agree things would be a lot better if he had a little more breathing space to properly practice his craft...something in which he has been unsurpassed since first taking that role at Fox.
KoHoSo -- really excellent summary!
ReplyDeleteRe: JohnP 5/2 @2:53PM —
ReplyDeleteI did hear one of them, (Larry Mac?), say, (paraphrasing here), that Stewart was experimenting with the setup in looking to preparing for the 2nd Richmond race.
more people watch fox's prerace show than watch the race on tnt or espn ! fox gives you the best replays and explanation when something happens whether it is a wreck or mechanical issue...fox will be missed !
ReplyDeleteCan't comment on the voices in the booth or pit road for much due to the fact the camera work drove me to radio within 12 laps & the tv was muted for 20 minutes or so.
ReplyDeleteTHEN, the camera work was perpetually so disjointed (per usual) but with CLOSE UPS of "parts of a maroon car roof" that took up 3/4 of the 52 inch screen oh my mate's tv i was trying to view...I thought "WHY aggravate myself with the NASCAR suits/David Hill's agenda of -what they want us to see".
so off went the tv...enjoyed Joe Moore & Barney Hall...tried the tv a couple of times only to get vertigo as others mentioned :-(
Turned on for the last 20 laps but that camera work STANK as well. :-(
SPEED Truck race was much improved but they are also sometimes missing the wrecks & using too much in car cam.
but NOTHING like the Saturated abundance fest of DIRECT TV/in car/roof top/side cams/bumper cams/ground cams/scanner audio sponsors". As i said last year, same thing each week. Lather, rinse, repeat.
I give up. :-(
June 6th boys and girls. if TNT pulls this crap, I'm DONE with TV.
If Camera work IMPROVES with TNT I won't be online much on twitter or here.
If this is the work of David Hill, I do not understand.
Folks thought he aggravated us with Digger??
PLEASE, somebody TIME the race we're FORCED to see from ZOOM/inCar/Bumper Cams aka Adds to the "wide shots" we NEED to see to enjoy the race.
The ZOOM HD cams from inside the car to show a pass is a killjoy to the perspective of Watching the race
I don't care WHO is in the booth.
The camera.work.is.killing.the.enjoyment.
Sorry folks, but there was no way any telecast could have made that race a winner. I was there - and I LOVE Richmond racing - and the race was a boring, seat-numbing, fun-killing snoozer until the last 15 laps. Maybe the ADHD camera work was an attempt to spice up the non-action on the track. Fox gets a pass for this one, because there was NO WAY they could win with the product they had to work with.
ReplyDeleteI'm not sure covering KK's too-tight-in-the-shoulders driver suit would have helped matters.
Someone should have covered every second of Thursday night's Denny Hamlin Foundation race at Southside Speedway. Wow, what a barn-burner! Great racing, super for the fans. And a local racer beats Denny on turn 4. Wonderful story.
Where was Mike Joy during this race?...oh yeah, he was getting talked over by Larry Mac. Larry you are not pxp, let Mike do his job and it will be better for all.
ReplyDeleteI watched Victory Lane with JR, Kenny, and Kyle twice this weekend. What a great program! This show was one not to be missed, I got more from that show than anything FOX did all weekend.
Typical Fox broadcast. Announcers talking about something we never see on the screen. DW and Larry Mac talking over the top of Joy, especially in the closing laps. No real updates on why some high profile drivers were really struggling. We've seen the same formula from Fox for 9+ years. Nothing is going to change that.
ReplyDeleteIf there was 3 and 4-wide racing, we rarely got to see it. It was hard to tell if the race itself was that boring of the Fox crew just missed the real action.
Well thats the thing. When he does get a chance to talk he's still by far the best in the business and one of the best in sports. The problem is Larry Mac just doesn't know his role in the booth more than anyone. I just don't think Joy deserves the criticism because if David Hill makes a personel move he may be the first to go and then there could just be utter chaos in that booth. I just think he is dealing with two huge ego's in the booth right now. If Larry Mac ever got the play by play job I think I'd have the TV on permanent mute.
ReplyDeletePlus at the same time I can tell he is reading the complaints because Talladega aside from the run to the checkered (where he got talked over by the two despite his best efforts because if you listen he was still calling the finish) he was offering almost MRN descriptive play by play. Take for example the call of the Newman or Gordon wrecks. I like Marty Reid but at the same time compare his call to the checkered last week at Talladega, very little if no description and a huge understatement of that final wreck.
At the end of the race,DW seemed to pick a different favorite each lap! I thought all three guys in the booth went overboard with the hyberbole. They need to shut up,focus on the race and talk only if its important to what's happening on the track.That especially goes for DW. Again,twice during green flag,they went to long-winded Hammond to explain something that wasn't the least bit important. And again,the lap tracker was way behind. There'd be a position change up front,and half a minute later,it would still show the old order.They kept talking about the smoke coming from the back of the #18. Not once did they get a camera shot of the right side of the car to see if it was coming from the exhaust pipes,tire rub or from the tires. The Gibbs cars have long belched smoke from the exhaust pipes when they got off the gas,perhaps due to the ring package they run. But the booth was content to just speculate. I couldn't believe Victory Lane. Dave Rogers wins his first Cup race and not only does he not get to sit with the three wind bags,he didn't even get an interview through one of the pit reporters. What was with that? I forced myself to watch all of Race Day. Herme Sadler is an unsung hero who along with Wendy are the only reasons to watch it.
ReplyDeleteNot much TV could do to save this Cup race for most of it, only the end was truly exciting. But FOX needs to spell out what they want their guys to do. If they still want Joy to do PxP then TELL HIM. Tell the director we need to see the racing. If DW is getting paid by the word then STOP. Please. I don't understand why coverage is worse than last year's, if it really is due to a network philosophy shift then they need to shift it back. But without rodent.
ReplyDeleteOnce again I really appreciate more extensive post race coverage being moved to SPEED but for Pete's sake!!! You have to tell the viewers you are doing that!! I missed most of it since I didn't see it mentioned on FOX, I didn't think they were doing it.
SPEED's Victory Lane is a joy to watch. Most complete recap and meaningful interviews of any post race show, hands down. Awesome job, and I miss it when SPEED can't do from rainouts.
Rockin Rich. With great respect, you make my point that much more valid. A top tier driver, two time champion, doing testing for setups for another track at an actual Cup race. That simply does not happen unless the car was total junk. No reports from the booth(maybe a short sentence), no reports from pit road. I did not hear that comment you talked about. But if true or not, it validates the lack of coverage of what is going on at the race.
ReplyDeleteAs to why there was no Heath Calhoun segment: Sgt. Calhoun was named the contest winner by race sponsor Crown Royal. Since Crown Royal did not pay FOX an extra fee, it was easy to ignore Sgt. Calhoun except for a small mention of him and a cameo appearance when he gave the command. Nevertheless, the lack of a full feature on FOX was a shame.
ReplyDeleteAlso, does anyone know if race coverage was pre-empted in the New York City area due to the attempted bombing of Times Square?
As for the coverage itself, it was the same as before. It's time for FOX to make some major changes. Ten years of this is enough!
I would just add to clarify that Crown Royal did not pay ESPN a fee for the feature on NASCAR Now, SportsCenter or ESPNEWS.
ReplyDeleteAfter telling us for ten years that FOX Sports supports the military and using American flag images in many NASCAR TV elements, this was a huge FAIL. Huge.
JD
FOX provided the same mediocre coverage. However what really bothered me was DW babbling all night. He just threw out inaccurate statements for Mike, Larry or the viewers to correct. Incorrect stats, flip flop opinions, flip flop bandwagons. He was just awful.
ReplyDeleteI'm so tired of what the local affiliates do to the NASCAR coverage in the Philly metro area I'm ready to give up on the sport if its not dumb snow coverage or stupid parades it's political debates............they don't care.
ReplyDeleteI have been watching NASCAR since before the invention of the in-car camera/bumper cam. I remember the reaction of most fans when the first in-car cameras became available. It was sort of wow/golly/gee-whiz/ain't technology amazing!
ReplyDeleteI also remember that the first such cameras needed a helicopter hovering above the track to relay the signals to the broadcast truck. I can recall times when the announcers said that they had lost the in-car cameras because the helicopter had to land for refueling or because of bad weather.
Beyond my initial "wow" reaction to the cameras, I never thought they were worth much. For me, the only time that they added anything was a replay of a wreck to see how a driver got involved or made his way through it. An occasional look at a driver was OK when you could see his face and body as he drove. And on a road race, it was worth maybe 30 seconds of video and commentary to compare left foot braking/right foot braking/heel and toe, etc. while focused on the drivers' feet.
It isn't even useful to look at drivers anymore. Before the advent of today's safety equipment, you could actually see a driver's face and body as he drove. Today you have full firesuits, full-face helmets, wrap-around seats with large head supports, etc. Looking at a driver today under green flag racing is like looking at an astronaut on a space walk. You can see nothing but a mummy, and there could be anybody in there. I am an ardent supporter of all of the safety gear and do not advocate a return to the "good old days". However, I don't see any reason to focus on a driver in the car unless it is under caution with the helmet visor up.
Fox has taken the in-car camera technology that had very limited usefulness to me and turned it into a major aggravation. In-car views now are an excuse to display sponsor decals for brief periods to generate revenue from advertisers. They add nothing to the race coverage and disrupt the flow of the story. In the extreme, they become disorienting. There have been times when I have stopped watching because of the constant jumping around.
In-car cameras always had very limited useful things to add to race coverage for me. With what Fox has done with them, I wish they had never been invented.
The omition of Sgt. Calhoun was nothing more than Fox choosing to push their agenda rather than do whats right. It would not have hurt them to do an indepth profile in the prerace or during the first half of the snooze fest that was the race. In years past they have done an interview with the Crown Royal "contest winner" before the spring race. To not give any details of this hero was just wrong in my opinion. Instead we had to hear about the non feud between Gordon and Johnson that the media desperately wishes was real. The race telecast was sub par as usuall. And just think, DW will make RaceDay even more unbearable for 6 weeks while Kyle Petty does TNT. I'm hoping the coverage gets better soon. I have high hopes for ESPN this year but we'll have to wait and see.
ReplyDeleteThis note from Brad is the first we've heard that DW is going to be around to cover Raceday. We have been waiting patiently for him to take his big mouth and get out of here.There is simply no way we can listen to him and Kenny Wallace on the same show. What is Fox/Speed thinking of to allow these shows to go down the tubes like this when they do have lots of decent people around who are doing a good job for them?
ReplyDeleteDidn't get home until 7:45pm ET Saturday night so listened to the entire MRN Radio pre-race.
ReplyDeleteIt was simply awesome!!!
Can the same be said for FOX or was it another "Slice of Pizzi?"
oh no! Not DW on Raceday! Well, just another reason why I won't watch that show. Racing shows need to be 98% Waltrip free zones!
ReplyDeleteWe confirmed a while back that DW was going to host RaceDay on SPEED during the six summer TNT races.
ReplyDeleteThis is a move driven by David Hill from FOX Sports. Hill was recently put in charge of SPEED and wasted no time making changes.
Many have emailed to say that DW on RaceDay is going to be a disaster. Only time will tell.
JD
Oh Lord. And I thought DW disappeared into a black hole when TNT took over. JD, do you know if DW will still be on Trackside? It seems that he leaves and Sadler takes over at the same time Fox stops their Nascar shows.
ReplyDeleteDarcie,
ReplyDeleteElliott Sadler is still listed as being on Trackside. The only opening was for Kyle's place on RaceDay for those six shows.
JD
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ReplyDeleteI can't begin to imagine DW,Kenny Wallace and Kyle Petty on Race Day. I refuse to watch RD now. Guess I'll have to block that channel!
ReplyDeleteKyle Petty will be working for TNT those weeks.
ReplyDeleteThe line-up will be John Roberts, Darrell Waltrip and Kenny Wallace.
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