It's been a very long day for the NASCAR on ESPN team. The conclusion is the Nationwide Series race with Marty Reid on the call.
Nicole Briscoe will open the pre-race with Rusty Wallace and Brad Daugherty from the Infield Pit Studio. Reid will be joined for the race by Dale Jarrett and Andy Petree, who have been on the air since noon. On pit road are Jamie Little, Vince Welch, Dave Burns and Dr. Jerry Punch. Tim Brewer is in the Tech Garage.
RIR is a tight little track where the action happens fast and the racing is rough. Trying to follow the script of zooming in tight has failed ESPN time and time again in producing this telecast. We shall see if they try the same thing tonight.
This post will serve to host your comments on the ESPN2 production of the Nationwide Series race from Richmond. To add your TV-related comments, just click on the comments button below.
Hey folks, thank goodness for nice weather tonight. Been raining down that way a LOT.
ReplyDeleteThe KHI shutdown should have led the show. Not an overhyped rivalry among teammates
ReplyDeleteIt never was on NN today! They followed the Cup hype script.
ReplyDeleteHappy Race Night Planeteers <3
ReplyDeleteWish the rain would come here to TX :(
Chasing each other to the garage:
ReplyDelete#03 Scott Riggs
#41 Johnny Chapman
#42 Tim Andrews
#44 Jeff Green
#46 Chase Miller
#47 Brian Keselowski
#48 Dennis Setzer
#49 Mark Green
#71 Matt Carter
#75 Carl Long
--------------------
DNQ's that would have raced:
#04 Fain Skinner
#08 Casey Roderick
#13 Jennifer Jo Cobb
#50 TJ Bell
I think the KHI situation is the tip of the iceberg. If a successful team can't survive, what will happen to the less successful ones?
ReplyDeleteWhy does Espn even bring that cutaway car? Or for that matter the entire Tech Garage? Just give Brewer a tire and a cameraman cause every segment he does involves a tire. Tires are round, tires blow out, ect...
ReplyDeleteBrad drops a mini bombshell "Jason Leffler has been told he wont have a ride next year". Im not surprised at all. Hasnt done anything in a long time. Solid back half of the top 10 but no chance of winning. Im willing to put money on James Buescher replacing him next year.
ReplyDeleteHold the presses, Jason Leffler does not have a ride in 2012? Where did that come from? Steve Turner must not be happy.
ReplyDeleteAlso: GO KENNY
Also again: Hi guys.
Roland: I would open the ride to Josh Wise, Immediately.
ReplyDeleteDid Brad say "Craftsman Truck Series" during the pre-race?
ReplyDeleteThe promos that ESPN is running for tomorrow's race say that Junior and "Smoke" have to win to get in the Chase. WRONG!
Um...is the mic low or is she that bad? She sounds nasally as hell.
ReplyDeleteYeesh...
ReplyDeleteRe: The Anthem
ReplyDeleteAll the cats in the alley behind my house just took off........
Well Josh Wise isnt marrying the boss' daughter. But he is very deserving of a ride.
ReplyDeletePeople I would open the #38 to: Josh Wise, Jeremy Clements, Mike Bliss, Nelson Piquet Jr (considering he don't have a ride next year :( )
ReplyDeleteSolid "F" for the anthem. Not only did she sound nasally, she was out of breath when it came time for a high note and I could hear everytime she swallowed. Just awful.
ReplyDelete49 made the field? STOP THE PRESSES.
ReplyDeleteI would love it if Kenny Wallace won this. Kenny got gypped earlier this year, got to 3rd, then got relegated to 13th by pit road.
BTW, that whole Kevin Harvick thing today has shaken up the entire sport! TV guys might not say it, but it was huge.
ReplyDeleteSo were sure Harvick was lying when he said he wanted to focus on cup?
ReplyDeleteanother awful mailbag question.
If Nascar is looking to make a come back they have to put together a better television broadcast.
ReplyDeleteSome are sugggesting that the Harvick "merger" is due to family problems.
ReplyDeleteWhy did they zoom in when if they zoomed out they could have shown two battles going on.
ReplyDeleteFree Nascar.com Raceview tonight with scanners. After double-clicking at least six different links to get to it, I was successful.
ReplyDeleteWell, like in these kind of situations where there is no clear answer...we just wait for the other shoe to drop.
ReplyDeleteOf course Cup 1-2-3-6. Where have we seen this before? Oh yeah, every freaking week
ReplyDeleteThey use the overhead camera show and they are so zoomed in you can only see 3 cars then zoomed to one. Is not one reason for a camera that high is to get a wider shot of the track?
ReplyDeleteNo virtual video on trackpass for me.
ReplyDeleteshow = shot
ReplyDelete:| - This is a blast so far, Carl Edwards winning, again
ReplyDeleteDanica going to have a long night.
ReplyDeleteKeeping the camera on Danica even though she is already a lap down.
ReplyDeleteThese Cup drivers really suck the life out of these races, don't they?
ReplyDeletezoom out, other cars around the car you are singling in on has to make different decisions because of the cars around him. Show it.
ReplyDeleteSally: That's an understatement. I want Edwards to get that ESPN job, gets him out of the 60 and maybe can put someone needing a ride in the 60. If Joe Gibbs let McDowell take the 18 and Truex get the 20, and Penske gave Hornish the 12 (confirmed I believe), along with the 22 to Jacques Villenvue (full time ride). I'd be very happy.
ReplyDeleteMarty Reid....he's already bored!
ReplyDeleteWell I struggled to find an MRN station that streams, then got a phone call on the pace lap and just now got done with that. Still havent found an MRN station. All the ones that usually stream are either not streaming or on high school football. Has MRN told stations not to online stream?
ReplyDeletebooo they skipped over mentioning Kenny Wallace
ReplyDeleteRoland, officially they cannot stream this content online.
ReplyDeleteThe stations that do are usually in small markets that Turner and NASCAR are not going to chase.
You can try the "I heart radio" app for portable devices.
Graphic Fail: 6th - 7th - 8th - 9th - 10th - 1st - 2nd - 3rd - 4th - 5th - 6th - 7th - 8th - 9th - 10th.
ReplyDeleteI liked the 8th through 15th through the field, gave highlight to the teams that need it.
Yay Caution. Boo not Cup Driver
ReplyDeleteWait a minute, The 20 is sponsored by Schick(sp?), and Busch and Hamlin are Gillette young guns?
ReplyDeleteI'm not surprised.
Is it just me that is dozing off?
ReplyDeleteI think MRN might have chased, cause I went through about 30 stations, most of which usually have the race, and I either got High School Football or "Stream not available due to broadcast restrictions" which I never used to get. Worked fine every week till now.
ReplyDeleteI dont get it at all. My local station dumped Nascar after last season. Online streams give people like me in areas with no access the chance to listen, as well as hear the advertisements. Its not hurting a thing.
With free Trackpass, scanners, and leaderboard, youd think Nascar.com would make the MRN stream available. Wrong.
Because of all this I havent paid attention to anything going on in this race. Guess Ill rewind to the beginning and start over.
Steven Wallace was moving when that caution came out. He's now 5th? Anyone for a surprise?
ReplyDeleteNot too impressed with coverage - booth is weak, camerawork is weak and even when they can use a longer shot here and there, they go back to narrow focus on the top 3.
ReplyDeleteMay just end up turning off the TV broadcast altogether.
online streaming WNBD Daytona Fl
ReplyDeleteThis broadcast has been a load of **** so far. I saw the #40 blowing up in the corner of the screen, but it did not fit the ESPN agenda. Instead we got a shot of a crewman.
ReplyDelete2 Cup drivers out in 2 seconds.
ReplyDeleteIs everyone asleep at ESPN? Reid has his energy set at about 20% right now.
ReplyDeleteThank you anon!!
ReplyDeleteHey, now, Busch - loads of manure are at least useful in agriculture.
ReplyDeleteI don't see why they can't use their Cup people to do/assist with broadcast mechanics and the booth.
This is his only opportunity, he got dumped off the Cup coverage and this is his reaction?
ReplyDeleteCome on Marty!
finally finished hunting for the free scanners for tonight's race. what a mess that site has become in recent years.
ReplyDeleteRed, next time you do get the scanner save that site to your favorites and it might work next time.
ReplyDeleteHey everyone. FYI - MRN is on Nascar.com's free Raceview tonight. You can choose to listen to the drivers, MRN radio or the officials.
ReplyDeleteI had to use the link on the NNS page itself. All the others opened to Trackpass sales page.
ReplyDeleteNASCAR.com = disaster.
ESPN will not allow online video streaming for the NNS races and they have the package through 2014.
ReplyDeleteNNS is trying to work with NASCAR.com to figure out what they can offer since that is not going to be a RaceBuddy style app.
I think this is a good step in the right direction. Get it sponsored and offer it for every NNS race next season.
Daly Planet Editor said...
ReplyDeleteNASCAR.com = disaster.
September 9, 2011 8:30 PM
How about:
NASCAR = disaster
If Edwards and Busch would not be there, Bayne, Stenhouse, K. Wallace, S. Wallace, Sadler Top 5, how does that sound? :)
ReplyDeleteI wasted the first 30 min fighting w/scanner, even logged in, got the "start the 14 day" screen. Ended up just clicking on the front page graphic and got right in. Sheesh!
ReplyDeleteHad no trouble finding trackpass, keyed in Nascar.com and it was right there on the front page.
ReplyDeleteWorking properly, now that's another question?
I'm really bummed that all this garbage is coming down in the sport on the opening NFL weekend.
ReplyDeleteNot good timing.
Pretty bad when a track that usually has some of the best races is either producing a dud, or the TV refuses to show any good action on the track. Never sure which it is.
ReplyDeleteThe Trucks & NNS both need a major revamp next season. This is complete boredom.
ReplyDeleteIf a new viewer just heard how many cars are out of the race and only saw a few wrecks don't you think they might wonder why.
ReplyDeleteSally, the booth should be chasing the racing and Marty should be pumping it up and making it exciting. That is his job.
ReplyDeleteThis is deadly TV.
You know BZF's 'solution' will be the add the 'chase' format to both of them.
ReplyDeleteGimme a break w/Barracuda already! Song came out when I was a Senior in HS, and its been played to death ever since!
ReplyDeleteJoe Gibbs has proven he has two development drivers (Truex and McDowell) that could easily do the job and maybe keep sponsorship (at least McDowell could), yet Busch and Logano/Hamlin dominate those two rides.
ReplyDeleteJD, you're absolutely right. However, the booth goes for the 'easy' shot of the leader(s) and ignores everything else. Marty has proven that he isn't the right man for PXP, as he has no frame of reference for the cars.
ReplyDeleteWith Patrick, Carmichael, and Pastrana coming in full time next year, it would be a good time to limit cup drivers. People will be watching anyway.
ReplyDeleteThey said there would be a rule change for 2012 earlier this season, I hadn't heard anything else though.
I hear ya Sally. We went to last Falls Cup race in Richmond. Came home and watched the DVR, and couldnt believe it was the same race we saw the day before. Totally different story with the TV presentation.
ReplyDeletetight shots do not show the race.
ReplyDeleteapropos of very little: just confirmed that i'm camping at charlotte in october for the night race! driving down thursday so i'll have time to visit my younger brother & family plus hit HOF! not gonna lie: i am not a camping sort of person but it will be a blast!
ReplyDeletewe discussed buying n'wide tickets now but decided to buy walk-up tickets instead. as my friend said "no track has sold out this year so why don't we wait & get tickets at the track?"
hoping the weekend re-energizes me for the sport. this race certainly isn't doing it for me.
red, good deal. Should be fun. Great time of the year to be there.
ReplyDeleteJerry: Yeah, that's right, Travis Pastrana, Ricky Carmichael and Danica Patrick, three stars from three different styles of automobiles. That should bring in viewers.
ReplyDeleteHowever, we need the Cup drivers to stop dominating. We've seen people like Bayne, Stenhouse, Kenny Wallace, Steven Wallace, Aric Almirola, Elliot Sadler, Michael McDowell, Ryan Truex, Reed Sorenson, Justin Allgaier, Michael Annett, and even others like Brian Scott, Josh Wise, Front Row Joe and Mike Bliss compete. All of them could put Ws in those columns, but that's hard when 22 of 26 races have been won by Cup drivers.
I'm telling ya, I am worried about the truck series surviving.
ReplyDeleteHaving KHI just throw in the towel is a stunner.
After more in-depth coverage on Danica - despite being a lap down and mediocre driving, it occurred to me:
ReplyDeleteBooth coverage is like someone talking about painting fire hydrants on the news while tornadoes rip through town and aliens incite the populace to riot.
Just missing everything.
Sigh...this is just bad.
ReplyDeleteMany folks on this blog and elsewhere want to severely limit or ban the cup drivers from racing in the JV series. I think that would be a mistake and would ultimately destroy the series. Many of us are familiar with some of the NNS drivers but many are not and would not attend or watch races when the majority of the drivers are unknown to them. I think race attendance would drop as would the number of viewers on TV. Worse than that, I think sponsorships or the value of them would drop dramatically. How many sponsors will sponsor an unknown?
ReplyDeleteWow! Caution, and Tims turnin a wrench w/ his hand! FASCINATING!
ReplyDeleteNice drivin' Danika
I think she gets a fine for that!!!
ReplyDeleteThe scanner is delayed when I listen to it but they called the spin before they showed it on Tv.
ReplyDeleteJD, that was our thinking. we're a small band of 5 or so but we're thinking of a yearly pilgrimmage to a track within reasonable driving distance. every year, a different track so we're now planning for bristol in 2012.
ReplyDeletei'm feeling that i want to get back to actually going to races when i can. tv has just drained all the excitement & energy out of out for me -- i may not even last tonight.
Good job Danica! Go find the 18 and the 60 and do the same thing.
ReplyDeleteOSBORNK,
ReplyDeleteHonestly, I would rather watch Allgaier battle K. Wallace, Sorenson and the regulars.
This just ain't getting it done.
red,
ReplyDeleteHaving the same struggle.
I think for the overall health of Nascar, either NNS or Trucks needs to be disolved. The racing is good in Trucks, but there's just no sponsorship available anymore. Look how many trucks in the past were sponsored by the manufacturer.. Chevy, Toyota, Power Stroke. You just knew those sponsorship packages were going to last.
ReplyDeleteOSBORNK, then NASCAR needs to tweak the engines of the 60, 18, etc when Cup drivers are in the car. Overall domination like this is not helping the underfunded teams.
ReplyDeleteAlso, if anyone saw qualifying, did anyone other than me notice Marty Reid handle a professional conversation that ended up letting Brad and Rusty blow hot air that they don't like the testing rules? I'm impressed.
@red Charlotte is good, but Bristol blows Charlotte out of the water. Youll have an awesome time.
ReplyDeleteJD--What we want to see won't keep the NNS series or the truck series alive. There has to be enough sponsors and fans to pay the bills.
ReplyDeleteNote to director, if you see smoke from one camera, either zoom out, or switch to a camera that shows where the smoke is coming from.
ReplyDeleteMarty's bored? Me, too. the races at richmond used to be lots of fun to watch, but they've been terrible for several years.
ReplyDeleteThere was an article the other day about putting the Chase in the other two series, that would actually keep eyes on those two series.
ReplyDeleteDo I question it? To some degree. At least if Stenhouse or Sorenson won the championship we won't have a winless champion.
This is turning into a classic Richmond race.
ReplyDeletePerhaps with the cup guys out you will see better racing and people like that. It may draw more people to watch.
ReplyDeletei have the tv on but i wouldn't exactly say i'm watching the race.
ReplyDeleteOSBORNK - I kind of agree with you. The problem with Nationwide is that nothing is going on. Ten cars park, fifteen regulars ride around underfunded just wanting to finish, another chunk have good equipment and do nothing with it (#11, 62, 66, etc). Danica is mid pack. That leaves #2, 6, 16, 18, 20, 22, 31, 32, 33, 60 as the only real contenders all season.
ReplyDeleteThe Nationwide series used to do just fine without all the Cup drivers as 'regulars'. They had their own 'stars' and their won fans. When Harvick had to run both series in 2001 because of losing Earnhardt, it gave the idea to other Cup drivers. Mark martin used to be the only Cup regular who ran th series regularly with a Cup team behind him. That's how he got all those wins in the series. The Busch series also didn't run on the same tracks as the Cup series as often, and ran more short tracks. It used to cost a LOT less to sponsor one of their cars. Now, the Cup teams have escalated the cost, along with Nascar, their COT's and inspection fees, etc.
ReplyDeleteRed, I'm headed to Charlotte for the October race, too. Bring a heavy coat - it is COLD in the stands at night in October, but lots of fun.
ReplyDeleteThe camera director has no idea what a car race is all about.
ReplyDeleteI don't think that having the cup drivers moonlighting in both the truck and the nationwide series on an unlimited basis is good for either one. I find it incredibly boring to watch the races every week knowing it will be the same people up front that I see on Sunday.
ReplyDeleteIMO, limit the # of races they can do in a season.
I was shocked to read the news about KHI folding its operation in trucks. If that doesn't make NASCAR think hard, they are totally brain dead.
This is becoming a wreckfest, as pictured for a short track. Those saying this was getting boring?
ReplyDeleteAnd Gina: Even when they dominate (like Stenhouse at IRP) they sometimes don't even end up winning.
ReplyDeleteMy MRN stream went to High School Football so I fired up the scanner. Listening to TBayne. Spotter warned him twice that the 88 (who was trying to pass him on that last run before the caution for the 14) had hit everything tonight. Caution comes out and Trevor says "he cant go anywhere cause he has the 20 blocking him all over the track and the 88 bonzai-ing him in every corner" crew chief says "your gonna have to do some growing up and be patient"
ReplyDeleteWe need more of this on the TV broadcast.
ESPN is almost as bad as Fox, all replays. To many side by side shots. Why have the blimp or helicopter show up?
ReplyDeleteAdam, the telecast is boring. As is often the case, an exciting race is going on in the background.
ReplyDeleteAlmorola dislikes ANYONE in a Gibbs car...THATS a fact since J.D. fired him a few years ago....J.D. was a smart owner with that decisiion....Almorola is a weapon, just not quite as bad as S. Wallace...
ReplyDeleteWe know Carl Edwards will be going to the booth, the question is for how long and when. If Jack Roush thought about it, I feel that Jeremy Clements deserves a ride (he's tried so hard since about 2007), I'd give him a shot in the 60.
ReplyDeleteAnd as a follow up a few minutes later Trevor says "Im sorry for getting so frustrated" and "go tell the 20 spotter that if he keeps blocking me we it wont be pretty"
ReplyDeleteNo offense JD, but unlike most of the people here, I don't know what tight angles are. I don't know camera views. I listen to Marty Reid, Dale Jarrett and Andy Petree. Brad Daugherty and Rusty are dead weight in my ears.
ReplyDeleteI enjoy a good race. I can tell when Marty screws up, but I am one of the few here who sees potential, especially after this afternoon's qualifying session. However, the dead weight isn't helping him.
And now ESPN jumps on what I just have been talking about
ReplyDeleteJD,
ReplyDeleteDo you think the poor broadcast is a result of the the networks not making any money? Wasn't it posted someplace that FOX & ESPN has lost money on each race broadcast?
Tomorrow night Michigan vs Notre Dame college football or more of this.
ReplyDeleteESPN really wants Leffler to do something to Harvick.
ReplyDeleteGina24: thanks! i'll take any advice folks can offer.
ReplyDeleteThis segment should be interesting.
ReplyDeleteThis 60/18 and 20/16 shot IS SO STUPID! What a waste!
ReplyDeleteEnough of the pit reporters, call the freaking race!
ReplyDeleteThey don't dare zoom out. It is like something bad will happen to them.
ReplyDeletenew drinking game - take a drink whenever someone says "he has a really really good car".
ReplyDeleteI see fuel strategy becoming important here. Anybody else?
ReplyDeleteThe booth said they could, but I question it.
I've been listening more to my driver's radio and scanning other assorted radio-stuff on the side than actually watching the broadcast.
ReplyDeleteDear Mr. TV Director,
ReplyDeleteI got a W I D E S C R E E N TV!
Please use it to its fullest view and fill it with cars racing each other!
No more split screens showing 2 cars each. You're driving me nuts!
Adam, yes, I know, I find it frustrating that when I tune into the race all I hear are - edwards, busch, blah blah blah. the difference between watching a race on TV (see all the single car shots) and being there (being able to watch the whole race) aggravates me beyond belief.
ReplyDeleteRed - it is usually really beautiful during the daytime, but I literally take an entire change of clothes for the race because I hate to be cold. I take my ski jacket, hooded sweatshirt, hat and gloves -- the locals look at me like I'm insane - but I'm not cold!
That got another shot in on Steven Wallace before the commercial. Not sure why.
ReplyDelete50 to go. Caution would be nice. Some racing to take out Harvick, Busch and Edwards would be better.
ReplyDelete@Charlie because of $$$. 5 Hour Energy money to be exact.
ReplyDeleteNo luck for Trevor, again.
ReplyDeleteHeard the Trevor thing live as it happened over his radio. He is not happy. And like Jamie said they warned him several times. Wow now him and Harvick into it. This is awesome to listen to!!!!
ReplyDeleteAnd STUPIDITY takes out the 16
ReplyDeletePARK THE 33 AND THE 38. THIS IS INSANE
ReplyDeletecongratulations they kept the camera on a race and then got to see a wreck as it happened.
ReplyDeleteIdiots, have at it.
ReplyDeleteWow, that's great a well funded CUP team takes out one of the regulars. Just because he can. Sheesh, glad I didn't spend money to drive to Richmond for this race.
ReplyDeleteAndy sounds bored out of his mind.
ReplyDeleteOMG OBJECTIVITY
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeletethe boys are not playing nicely tonight.
ReplyDeleteJamie "Kevin says his car got loose because of the 16". No freakin way. I would have never guessed
ReplyDeleteyou would think the booth would show a little excitement over an incident like that...but nooooo. they make exciting stuff boring. that takes real talent.
ReplyDeleteNone of them even raised a voice.
ReplyDeleteJD, your comment is absolutely on!
ReplyDeleteIdiots indeed.
ZOOMED-IN
ReplyDeletehmmm did someone in the truck wake up? they are showing some racing
ReplyDelete15 Laps to go.
ReplyDeleteThese one car camera shots are driving me CRAZY!
ReplyDeleteLike trying to watch a race through a telescope.
ReplyDeleteTop 2 are Cup drivers. The remaining 8 in the top 10 are Nationwide drivers.
ReplyDeleteDaly Planet Editor said...
ReplyDeleteLike trying to watch a race through a telescope.
Or a straw....
Marty Reid is better suited for calling a golf game than a race. No excitement in his voice. Boring.
ReplyDeleteoh gee, kyle is going to win again. Ho hum, no wonder people aren't bothering to buy tickets to these races.
ReplyDeleteYAWN!!! Thanks Kyle Busch and other for killing this series.
ReplyDeleteWell...that sucked.
ReplyDeleteboring
ReplyDeleteI'm really not impressed with Kyle winning the most Busch series races of all time. Not a big accomplishment when you can outspend 95% of the teams on the track.
ReplyDelete.....
ReplyDelete.....
.....
Do I need to say anything?
To summarize: Ryan Truex deserved his Top 5 finish. After 27 races, Kenny Wallace finally gets the first Top 5 of the season. (A lot of 6th and 7th). Timmy Hill and Danica Patrick get Top 20 finishes. Front Row Joe gets a Top 10.
See if we get a Kenny Wallace interview.
ReplyDeletePutting the points and results at the top on the ticker does not replace a full screen graphic. You cant pay attention to the points and results while your watching interviews. Hope the production truck knows this.
ReplyDeleteIf this is the coverage ESPN wants to provide, football is going to crush them.
ReplyDeleteWell...at least we have some new feuds. A few nice runs as well.
Blondie did'nt wear the fire suit?
ReplyDeleteJamie? Are you for real? The teams didnt merge effective immediately. Come on Jamie do your homework.
ReplyDeleteThe survey on trackpass ask me would I buy sprint/nationwide trackpass for $79.95.
ReplyDeleteKENNY!
ReplyDeleteAgreed with Roland. I think Jaime is way overrated as a pit reporter. Just a dumb question to Harvick about the merger and crashing cars.
ReplyDeleteWell, tomorrow night is on ABC. So....that should be fun.
ReplyDeleteHave a good night folks!
Lets dump quick for stick n ball. Ho hum.
ReplyDeleteSeeing Kenny get up in tears like that, it was great. A well-deserved top 5 for Kenny and Ryan.
ReplyDeleteI'll see ya guys tomorrow and see if my Jeff can get win #86 :)
You kind of get the feeling this is Kenny's last stand.
ReplyDeleteI don't call it a last stand. I call it a comeback.
ReplyDeleteHave a feeling he is moving back to the STL pretty soon.
ReplyDeleteAnd leave one of his best rides in years? I question that. I think he'd probably want to win before calling it a career.
ReplyDelete